How to improve the SM Support?

[ray1981]

Firstly I would like to state that I am not fully against SM, 90% of the game is extremely good and is the best online manager game on the net, sure there are flaws in the match engine, transfer system ewtc but these will happen and cannot be cured overnight, however one thing that irritates me to the max is the support system. At the ris to myself who has already been warned because I dare to speak out on this issue and have tried to be silenced(rep points reduced, threatend ban from the Forum) I feel it is necesary to address this issue further. I think SM need to remember that a Forum is a place for OPEN DISCUSSION and just because I hold a view they may not agree with I should not be forced into silence.

QUITE SIMPLY THE BIGGEST SINGLE MOST IMPORTNAT IMPROVEMENT SM COULD MAKE IS TO HAVE A HALF DECENT SUPPORT SYSTEM.

Let me explain:

The support system as it stands is little shy of poor. We are paying customers and as customers in any form or way of life you are allowed to ask questions, expect reasoning, response to any questions/queries you may have. It is simple customer service and is in my mind the first and most importnat service a company can offer is customer service to there consumer.

The current system isvery unhelpful in many cases, negligent of its members wants and requirements. Let me give you an example:

I bid in GC 19 for Ribad Diego of Barcelona 15m+Nocerino+Bastos which was accepted by the Barcelona manager. Twice we done this deal and twice it has been reversed by SM. Other managers have also done delas with the Barcelona manager who stated he wanted to revamp his squad they included such deals as Sessegnon+Keita for Arshavin. Both deals in themselves were fair enough but were stopped by SM.

I politely along with many other members wrote a Support ticket to query the situation as all deals were reversed, the manager in question has not been cheating, has not had his rep reduced, has not been relieved of his team so we simply cannot understnad why these deals have been stopped??

We all wrote support tickets but the reply from customer service as in a lot of cases was an automated response which tells you nothing. I along with others then PM SM Dev Ste and yet again no response. There is no logical explanation for the stopping of these transfers and all we ask for is a simple explanation. Is it to much to ask that for a bit of customer care?? In my job I have to explain my actions to my clients and they areentitled to an explanation of why I act in the way I do. SM is negligent in this regard with no real customer service worth noting, if everything is an automated reply and you cannot be held accountable by your consumers then why have a support service in the first place??

My suggestion is very very simple how about having a support system which lives up to its name actually supportds the customers needs. Would it be so difficult to have a system where there is actually a bit of customer care given, how about a proper response to each ticket, how about an explanation to its consumer for its actions, how about quite simply a Human Touch to there customer care, interacting with there customers is that really to much to ask??

With all the money SM has made since the reseve club feature and with nearly 2 GC'S a week and other setups they must be raking in at least £400+ a week surely it could be that some of this money is invested to give there customers the care they deserve, it would go a long long way to making there customers feel more valued rather than having an robotic response to everything which does not explain anything to its customers.

It is quite simply the single most importnat feature which could be used to improve the game, in any walk of life Customer Care is the single biggest responsibility for any company and in this regard with regards to support tickets I feel as many other members do that they are failing us. So much about the game is right but this is a major flaw and needs to be ironed out fast as more and more of its customers and I know I have canvassed opinion are getting more and more of its long standing members become more disillusioned by the day.

[Mr.Adamski]

Ray your not the first to highlight this, infact the magnitude of SM's customer service has been LONG debated.

Here are a handful of threds created that highlight different issues with the Support ticket system or how SM treat their customers.. Firstly some of the people may off broke the rules by being abusive, but some of their points stand

http://forum.soccermanager.com/showt...light=customer

http://forum.soccermanager.com/showt...hlight=support

http://forum.soccermanager.com/showt...hlight=support

http://forum.soccermanager.com/showt...hlight=support

http://forum.soccermanager.com/showt...light=customer - dated 2007
http://forum.soccermanager.com/showt...hlight=support

http://forum.soccermanager.com/showt...t=14244&page=2


Its not up to scratch, and needs to be improved.

[craigjohnson]

Just a quick post to show my support Ray, it's something that has rumbled on in the background for a while now, and something which really does need looking at, imo more urgently than the in-game improvements which so many are yearning for.

I think to be fair to them, the support system (to a point) works. The consistency is poor, and the "template replies" leave a lot to the imagination, but on the whole, the send ticket, get reply idea there is nothing wrong with it.

The thing that rankles with me is a lack of an effective grievance or appeals procedure at decisions which SM make, most of which are justified, but on the odd occasion where it is absoloutely plain to see that there has been a mistake made, there is no way to plead a case, to give the other side of the coin to them and in the end leads to many more disgruntled users or customers as there needs to be.

I was on about this with Adam yesterday no less, and all I feel it would take is an appeals section in support, whereby if a customer does feel he or she is unfairly treated for whatever reason, there's a chance for users to give their account of what went on and hopefully allow SM to see what happened from their point of view.

It's not far away from being a decent system. All I feel is lacking is a little bit of man-time answering support tickets fully and frankly if need be, and the appeals procedure mentioned above and it could be a good working model.

I do however agree that standards have slipped, and with the amount SM are making increasing beyond recognition since the implementation of club reservations, you'd think that the support offered to a ever-growing pool of customers would be a priority place to invest.

It would be interesting to see a dev's views on how effective they think the support system is, and whether there is also any plans in the offing for an overhaul of the support system.

I'm not working against SM here, if anything I think the people I've spoke to on the subject are actually wanting to help them, but when people are actively being stifled in what they say, as I know you have Ray for a bit of constructive criticism the other day it's bordering on silliness really. Surely there's some way we can get our points accross, they can listen, give their counter arguments and then go forward together with some sort of compromise?

We're not asking much, after all we want the game to meet their mission statement just as much as they do, it's us paying for the priveledge of using it. They want a better product which is going to attract more users, we want a more attractive product which meets our needs and makes us justify Gold Membership, reserving teams etc, why not at least try going forward together???

[Kazzer]

Not really much i can add to this, other than say i completely agree with both Ray and Craig here, and good posts by both.

[SM Dev (John)]

Hi Guys,

I would just like to nip this thread in the bud.

The support team that we have at SM do a fantastic job. Period.

Equating the reserve club feature with how good the support system is is a very flimsy and unconnected argument.

We have improved the support system hugely since SM first started and continue to do so.

We deal with 100's of tickets everyday and do our best to reply to them quickly, some with pre-set answers but many with detailed responses.

Being a Gold Member means that we prioritise to answer these tickets first, it does not mean we give you the answer you want.

Ray - We do not reply about transfer deals. If deals get reversed then use your head and realise why (as there is clearly something not right with the deal or other managers have reported it). Especially in the case of Gold Championships, if the rep hasn't been reduced is just means we are giving you a second chance instead of booting you off all your Gold teams. It is highly suspicious when a manager coming to the end of their Gold Membership starts selling all his best players. Others in the Game World also think so.

We could spend all our time dealing with support, and arguing and justifying every decision that we make to members who are not happy with a certain transfer decision, but we only have a finite amount of resources and a huge development plan to work through.

Ray - we still have a ticket we are awaiting a reply from you regarding your failed 'Reserve Club' with Juventus in a Gold Championship which has been open now for nearly two week.

Also, the infractions you received were to do with defamatory posts. We don't stop open debate but we do draw a line at that.

Mr.Adamski - Bringing up half a dozen posts from over the past 3 years which mention the word support in is hardly proof the support system doesn't work.

We can find other threads praising support and I will give you a recent example.

We could also post 100's if not 1000's of "thank you's" from members in the actual support tickets.

[craigjohnson]

Originally Posted by SM Dev (John)

We do not reply about transfer deals. If deals get reversed then use your head and realise why. (There is clearly something not right with the deal or other managers have reported it). Especially in the case of Gold Championships, if the rep hasn't been reduced is just means we are giving you a second chance instead of booting you off all your Gold Teams.

Even if there is "clearly something wrong with the deal" why:

* In some cases "managers have not broken the t's and c's"

and in other cases:

* deals get reversed and accounts suspended?

This is just one example of the inconsitencies, it's either one or the other. In practically EVERY deal, there is a winner and a loser, why in some cases is it justified that SM take action, and in others it is deemed that there has been no wrongdoing?

Your last post is simply adding to the argument, rather than have a bit of interaction, it's one post (and probably thread closed - or "nipping it in the bud ) and then we hear nothing more.

[SM Dev (John)]

Craig - I have edited the post to explain about the deal which originally started the thread.

Please see:

It is highly suspicious when a manager coming to the end of his Gold Membership starts selling all his best players. Others in the Game World also think so.

Your point

This is just one example of the inconsitencies, it's either one or the other. In practically EVERY deal, there is a winner and a loser, why in some cases is it justified that SM take action, and in others it is deemed that there has been no wrongdoing?

We come to a judgement on what action (if any) needs to be taken on a case by case basis. Depending on the cases we get different actions.

[craigjohnson]

Originally Posted by SM Dev (John)

Craig - I have edited the post to explain about the deal which originally started the thread.

Please see:


Your point


We come to a judgement on what action (if any) needs to be taken on a case by case basis. Depending on the cases we get different actions.

Right, that's fair enough, but it does highlight a flaw in the support system nonetheless.

All it would have took was a message when the deals were intially reversed to the innocent parties (ie Ray, Nino and Adam) to say why the deal was reversed.

For the sake of typing one sentence, 30 seconds of someone's time, copying and pasting it into 3 seperate messages and letting the managers involved know exactly why, it's left to descend into this, where tickets are going unanswered and managers are left to stew over it, thinking that they are being victimised for what, in their eyes is a fair enough deal which has been reversed for no APPARENT reason. It's all well and good having the mitigating sat in front of you, but the people involved didn't have that info, hence the fuss. If this had been made apparent, this would have been "nipped in the bud" a lot earler, and neither me, you, nor anyone else who has posted on or read this just waste an hour of their lives

Just think, in the hour that you've been trying to justify what SM did in this case, you could have stopped 15/20 more potentially coming to this.

Prevention is better than cure...

[ray1981]

Originally Posted by SM Dev (John)

Hi Guys,

I would just like to nip this thread in the bud.

The support team that we have at SM do a fantastic job. Period.

Equating the reserve club feature with how good the support system is is a very flimsy and unconnected argument.

We have improved the support system hugely since SM first started and continue to do so.

We deal with 100's of tickets everyday and do our best to reply to them quickly, some with pre-set answers but many with detailed responses.

Being a Gold Member means that we prioritise to answer these tickets first, it does not mean we give you the answer you want.

Ray - We do not reply about transfer deals. If deals get reversed then use your head and realise why (as there is clearly something not right with the deal or other managers have reported it). Especially in the case of Gold Championships, if the rep hasn't been reduced is just means we are giving you a second chance instead of booting you off all your Gold teams. It is highly suspicious when a manager coming to the end of their Gold Membership starts selling all his best players. Others in the Game World also think so.

We could spend all our time dealing with support, and arguing and justifying every decision that we make to members who are not happy with a certain transfer decision, but we only have a finite amount of resources and a huge development plan to work through.

Ray - we still have a ticket we are awaiting a reply from you regarding your failed 'Reserve Club' with Juventus in a Gold Championship which has been open now for nearly two week.

Also, the infractions you received were to do with defamatory posts. We don't stop open debate but we do draw a line at that.

Mr.Adamski - Bringing up half a dozen posts from over the past 3 years which mention the word support in is hardly proof the support system doesn't work.

We can find other threads praising support and I will give you a recent example.

We could also post 100's if not 1000's of "thank you's" from members in the actual support tickets.

SM DEV John

Firstly thanks for replying it makes a nice change to be listened to even if the content of your message was IMO rather scathing and just seemed to be a case of I am right you are wrong and somewhat scathing of our concerns and grievences.

I have never said all SM Support staff are not up to the job and neither have I ever said that SM does not do a good job, the point I was simply making is that a human touch is somewhat nice.

I am not involved in looking at transfer dealings and the fact that a member is coming towards the end of his GM is not something I would have thought would be in the thoughts of many when the deals were stopped, however you have given an explanation and that is fine just 1 simple sentence has explained everything, resolved the situation and whilst I dont agree with the course of action at least I can now understand it.

I never once stated SM was a rip-off either I have the posts which I wont quote but you are misquoting me I said and I wont use the actual quote for fear of reprecussions that SM was more concerned with "lining its pockets" which in retrospect was a bit strong but the underlying point about SM Support needing to IMO in some cases (not all) be better I stand by, you may not agree as it is clear from your rather strongly worded response.

Craig's point about there being a discussion is valid, it cant simply be a case of you saying we are right you are wrong all the time, all I am trying to do is put forward a forum for debate about these issues so that all points can be considered. We do not have to agree but I do not see why a healthy debate cannot be had here.

With regards to your so calling of my "lets shall we say failed reserve club" which makes it sound to me like I have done something wrong in the way it is written, when In fact all I had done was pay for a team and not receive it. I apologeise I had completely forgotten about it and I will address the issue in the next half-hour, it is not a deliberate oversight.

I would just like to say I do not want to be "enemies" as such SM is a wonderful game with many many fantastic achievements and features all me and a few others are doing is addressing areas we believe could be better. We appreciate all the work SM does and as stated 90-95% of the game IMo is fantastic however all we are doing is offering constructive criticism of how to make the game better which is obviously the same aim for both of us as we would like the game to "be the best it can be"

PS: Back reading your quote "we have not booted you all off and giving you a second chance" I do hope that you are not suggesting that me or any of the other managers who made bids for Barcelona players have done something wrong?? All we done was make bids we did not know or have access to your reasons, I detest cheating and would never partake in anything of the kind.

[Lew-uk]

Originally Posted by SM Dev (John)

Hi Guys,

I would just like to nip this thread in the bud.

The support team that we have at SM do a fantastic job. Period.

Equating the reserve club feature with how good the support system is is a very flimsy and unconnected argument.

We have improved the support system hugely since SM first started and continue to do so.

We deal with 100's of tickets everyday and do our best to reply to them quickly, some with pre-set answers but many with detailed responses.

Being a Gold Member means that we prioritise to answer these tickets first, it does not mean we give you the answer you want.

Ray - We do not reply about transfer deals. If deals get reversed then use your head and realise why. (There is clearly something not right with the deal or other managers have reported it). Especially in the case of Gold Championships, if the rep hasn't been reduced is just means we are giving you a second chance instead of booting you off all your Gold Teams. It is highly suspicious when a manager coming to the end of his Gold Membership starts selling all his best players. Others in the Game World also think so.

We could spend all our time dealing with support, and arguing and justifying every decision that we make to members who are not happy with a certain transfer decision, but we only have a finite amount of resources and a huge development plan to work through.

Also Ray we still have a ticket of we are awaiting a replay from you regarding your, shall we say 'Reserve Club Stunt' with Juventus in a Gold Championship.

Also, the infractions you received were to do with saying 'SM was a rip off and only interested in money.' We don't stop open debate but we do draw a line at that.

Mr.Adamski - Bringing up half a dozen posts from over the past 3 years which mention the word support in is hardly proof the support system doesn't work.

We can find other threads praising support.
http://forum.soccermanager.com/showp...92&postcount=8

We could also post 100's if not 1000's of "thank you's" from members in the actual support tickets.

It' not really my style to post on internet forums, as you can see from my post count!, but I feel compelled to add my opinion on this one. First of all I, like most, feel SM is a great product which most who play it would agree. Secondly, whenever I have needed to use the support system I have found it to be very good with prompt replies and acceptable responses.... and I can only imagine how difficult based on the number of members and game worlds it is to manage. However, the above post is downright arrogant and egregious. You are failing to provide your customers, some who have spent a lot of money on your product, a basic service ie. an appeals procedure. To blatantly dismiss it as you have in the above post is quite frankly verging on the negligent. To imply there is no link between the reserve club feature and support system is to insult our intelligence. If you are willing to take additional revenue off customers, to the point where now it is possible to join a GC with reduced reputation then there is indeed a link.

What would be wrong with a simple response of "it is something we may consider in the future, any suggestions welcomed" instead of an inflammotary response. Easy enough I suppose when you can hide behind the veil of the internet. I know it is very difficult to manage everyone's expectations but at least try.

Anyway, having said that I do propose a compromise. How about an appeals procedure which is triggered by say 5 or even 10 tickets. In Ray's example he says several managers sent tickets regarding deals. If enough people feel strongly about it then surely that warrants a response. They may not like the reply but at least they feel they have received some kind of customer service. Im sure if you put say a 2 week time limit on replying to 'appeal' posts that would be reasonably acceptable as well. I dont think anyone is under any illusions about how much work is surely involved in trawling through all the suport tickets.

You have a great product which is in danger of losing many customers and from what I've read on this forum your reputation and image is starting to become tarnished. Come on SM listen to your customers!!

[SM Dev (John)]

Hi Lew-Uk,

Glad to see you are posting on the forum, always nice to see new faces.

My response on the thread titled "How about a Support System that works!" was defending the support system from unfair criticism on a support team that have pride in their work and do a fantastic job.

Everyone who works for SM spends a huge amount of time responding and dealing with SM support tickets. Dealing with bugs and improvements based on them as well as helping with queries etc.

The support system does 'work' and works very well.

[Dan Walmsley]

To avoid confusion, this post has been edited by myself after some of the response below.

Okay well, i am happy to report that i have recieved a very detailed response from the support section and i am much happier with the treatment i have recieved.

If my response was brought on from this thread then i can certainly say that something good has come from it Ray. While my ban from the SM shop has not been lifted, i at least have the oppurtunty to have it reviewed in the coming weeks which is a much fairer outcome IMO and one that i can atleast be content with in the meantime.

[SM Dev (Ste)]

Originally Posted by Dan Walmsley

Sm Dev John - Could you please explain why such an effort is being made to delete my posts on an open dicsussions board and why my support ticket is not being treated with the same kind effort?

You were advised in your deleted post at 11:56 AM that you have been notified on several occasions of the action taken and why and to refer to your Support Ticket.

Originally Posted by Dan Walmsley

I'm in the same boat as Ray, i think 95% of this game is fantastic but as a paying customer am i not allowed to express the %5 that isn't great?

We do not stifle anyone's opinion and we welcome constructive criticism.

Originally Posted by Dan Walmsley

If not, could you please address me via PM and maybe take a look at my support ticket? Thanks

I believe that you have had a detailed reply to your Support Ticket and I presume that you have not yet read it.

[ray1981]

Fantastic Post Lew and as John said welcome to the forum with reasoned debate like that you are a welcome addition.

We all want the same thing, its just frustrating with the way SM approaches this issue as though it is above reproach. The criticism offered is constructive and I can assure you that a vast majority have the same concerns that I have expressed. With a reply so damning it just makes me and others feel that our custom/our opinions are not valid or certainly not going to be taken on board.

Now maybe I am being a bit paranoid but I feel like you have "got it in for me" so to speak and I would hope that you value mine and other members custom though whether you are actually bothered about "my custom personally" I am not so sure. As I say I may be being paranoid but shooting me down in flames etc makes me feel this way. I have played SM and paid a lot of money to the company for ages, love the game just my whole mission here is to try and help customers/SM feel more in tune with each other is that so wrong??

As For Dan's post being constantly deleted I dont understand it again he was airing a grieveance it had nothing derogatory or used any bad language from what i can remember of it so why has it been deleted?? It is almost like a form of censorship that any post is removed if anything that does not praise SM(and I do praise SM on numerous threads for many matters) is removed

Edit: I will praise SM now with regards to the last paragraph as Dan says a simple response which is not automated makes us as the customer feel a lot more valued and answers our grievence, if this thread has in any way helped with this then it has been a success, but well done to SM on Dan's issue for addressing it promptly and with proper reasoning that is all we are asking we dont want to fight just try and help in the games general improvement

[Mr.Adamski]

Originally Posted by SM Dev (John)

Mr.Adamski - Bringing up half a dozen posts from over the past 3 years which mention the word support in is hardly proof the support system doesn't work.

We can find other threads praising support and I will give you a recent example.

No i brought half a dozen threads, that highlighted a sustained problem of customer interaction throughout SM's history

You may well of found one thread supporting the system / customer interaction etc but the vast majority of people dont think its up to scratch