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Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres


Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres  

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

Everybody's going to be biased towards their own players' date=' that's just natural as a fan, but you can't compare two players from two different countries, who haven't played in the same league.

What if Crouch had moved to the Croatian league ? Would we be praising him or doubting him ? Nobody knows. What about if RVP moved to La Liga as Torres is going the other way, would he succeed ? Probably, but again nobody really knows for sure, as nobody knows about Torres, Crouch and Eduardo.

So how can they be compared ?

And Arsenal fans, i'm not biased towards any of these players, but your calling Crouch's ability, isn't this the same guy who netted a hat-trick against you last season ?[/quote']

think that is a great post, it will fall on deaf ears but its spot on imo

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres Morientes didnt adapt to the style in England' date=' look at shevva, you dont always get it right. Aurelio...nice words of facts there - "not good". Hmm...

Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres Everybody's going to be biased towards their own players, that's just natural as a fan, but you can't compare two players from two different countries, who hav

Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

Your rating Crouch to Suker?! Im keeping this on Eduardo :) I was also mentioning the ratio' date=' 1 out of 5. Suker had 6 out of 11, dont see what this has to do with my point, Rooney...scored 0 n the WC, he must be poor right?

Ok then, i am not right, but who am i proving this too? Few biased gooners? Not gonna keep me up at night if it doesnt get through.

I rate Crouch, no matter what people say, they say hes scored vs bad teams etc, he has done it vs good clubs too, just like Eduardo and all Fs. You say Henry, you telling me he doesnt score lots of goals ve weaker nations? He scored goals for Saints a few years ago, got his move, and despite people not liking him, he does his job, which is to score when he plays.

Well they arent in Europe for a start! You telling me the likes of Mexico and the US would make it? They do so well, but might not make it in Europe. You cant compare things like that, as they have been playing their all their careers, totally random comparison IMO.

They are intl class, otherwise they wouldnt have an intl team :rolleyes: Teams like Estonia, teams Eduardo has scored against, also, Eduardo is Cro's main F atm, has more games and chances to score vs teams, Crouch has far less as hes often 3rd/4th choice F.

And if you call Uruguay + Greece poor teams, then theres something a tad strange about you....considering Eduardos goals barring Russia/Eng/Italy have been vs 'poor' teams too.

Yes its 20%, but it was 1 out of 5! You have to look at how many goals were scored before you can say 20% is bad, especially considering 1 of those was an O.G.[/quote']

1. You don't seem read posts. I wrote somewhere that I'm not comparing Suker and Crouch. I'm just telling that if Suker scored one goal Croatia would have had total of 6 goals. and that would be even lower percentage than Crouch had. Every attacker has opportunity to contribute. Crouch did, but nothing spectacular. And that was the only thing I was trying to say. He scored but didn't do anything spectacular and you seem to emphasize his ratio and this scoring record as an evidence of a class striker.

I have also said that I'm not trying to discredit Crouch and that I also think he is undervalued and has a good technique and coordination for a man of his height and structure.

And I'm not trying to compare him to Eduardo. That would be silly atm.

2. If you are not interested of proving sth, why are you waisting your time?? If you are entertained by that it's OK, but then why would anybody care what you said, wanted to say or anything else. We can all say that we were joking and "quiet Bosnia".

3. They aren't in Europe for a start! - That was totally unnecessary. I said if they were in Europe not that they are in Europe. And my point was - read carefully - one national team can't be considered as a top quality team because they have qualified for WC. A lot of quality teams can't even make to WC because for example in Europe competition is way tougher. Some other continents are easier to qualify from.

4. I'm not comparing Eduardo and Crouch. I didn't say Crouch is scoring against poor teams. I didn't say Uruguay and Greece are poor teams. Anything else??B)

5. 20% is actually a relative number. It doesn't matter how many goals were scored. It shows how many goals had one footballer scored compared to a total number of goals.

From my post here - "I'm not blaming him for not scoring more. I'm just saying that his logic isn't right. England scored 5 so 1 Crouch's goal is great because it is 20% of all England goals. One goal is one goal. It is a goal but it isn't much." it was impossible for an average person to conclude that i think 20% is bad! Again it was not the point.

Why are you emphasizing it was 1 out of 5??:confused: What are you trying to say??

If Suker scored 1 goal it would have been 1 out of 6. So what?? What does it mean?? He scored 5 more so it is 6 of 11. If crouch scored say 4 goals it would be 4 out of 8.

But you don't seem to understand what I was trying to say here. And not just here but your conclusions on my posts are almost all wrong. I don't want to waste my time anymore on discussing with you because you are either joking or completely failing to understand me - which wouldn't be so bad if you asked for explanations. But you are not. You just make unreasonable conclusions and then reply to what you think I was saying.

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

Nav and Zaz, there is no real point in comparing a player who played 8 years ago to one playing now. Times have changed, different levels of skills are needed... so many things have changed since WC98...Sure Suker had strengths and if you compare goal tallys then the rate is better, but the quality of defenders and the style of play has varied a lot recently.

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

Nav and Zaz' date=' there is no real point in comparing a player who played 8 years ago to one playing now. Times have changed, different levels of skills are needed... so many things have changed since WC98...Sure Suker had strengths and if you compare goal tallys then the rate is better, but the quality of defenders and the style of play has varied a lot recently.[/quote']

Darsh, I totally agree. But I'm not comparing them. I was using Suker as an example.

England - 5 goals Crouch 1

Croatia - 5 goals without Suker - nearly the same as England

Croatia - 11 goals including Suker

It doesn't matter how many goals one team scores. Every player has the right to add few more. And according to their ability they do that. Crouch scored one. It is not bad but nothing to be emphasized.

EDIT: England scoring only 5 goals (one was o.g.) means that their strikers didn't do well. Why? Completely new topic.

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

Darsh' date=' I totally agree. But I'm not comparing them. I was using Suker as an example.

England - 5 goals Crouch 1

Croatia - 5 goals without Suker - nearly the same as England

Croatia - 11 goals including Suker

It doesn't matter how many goals one team scores. Every player has the right to add few more. And according to their ability they do that. Crouch scored one. It is not bad but nothing to be emphasized.[/quote']

Im not disagreeing with you either mate! But I still believe using an example from these past 1 or 2 years would be better.

Anyway, back on topic, I believe van Persie is a better player than Torres because he is Dutch. :P

Nah, I tend to prefer more versatile players, and players who can produce moments that can just leave your jaws wide open. van Persie is capable of these things more than Torres; we saw one example against Charlton last season at the Valley...remember THAT volley? He can also play on the wing, something Torres cant do. Although I fully expect Torres to settle in after a few months, if Benitez tinkers and tinkers Torres will not become the 20 goal-a-season striker he is expected to become. Having said that, having Dirk Kuijt by his side is only gonnd help him. Kuijt is a fantastic forward in the sense that he likes to drop deep and provide others with glorious opportunities. He holds the ball up well to bring others into play, and I strongly feel Torres can take full advantage of this.

Back with van Persie and Arsenal, I believe the Dutchman will become a key key key figure for Arsenal, especially since Henry has gone. IMO, he doesnt really need a strike partner; he can do the job well on his own. However, if Wenger comes back to his senses and decides to play Rosicky in his preferred AM position, behind van Persie preferably, then the two could blossom and become one of the most feared attacking pairs in the country.

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

Completely agree.

Think that RVP and new signing Eduardo could potentially be better then they are just by the midfield of Fabregas, Hleb and Rosicky, who IMO are three of the best passers in the EPL. Arsenal will still be a major force this season, everyone panicking at the departure of Henry, but look at the squad he was playing with, RVP is just another fine example of that.

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

1. You don't seem read posts. I wrote somewhere that I'm not comparing Suker and Crouch. I'm just telling that if Suker scored one goal Croatia would have had total of 6 goals. and that would be even lower percentage than Crouch had. Every attacker has opportunity to contribute. Crouch did' date=' but nothing spectacular. And that was the only thing I was trying to say. [b']He scored but didn't do anything spectacular and you seem to emphasize his ratio and this scoring record as an evidence of a class striker. [/b]

I have also said that I'm not trying to discredit Crouch and that I also think he is undervalued and has a good technique and coordination for a man of his height and structure.

And I'm not trying to compare him to Eduardo. That would be silly atm.

2. If you are not interested of proving sth, why are you waisting your time?? If you are entertained by that it's OK, but then why would anybody care what you said, wanted to say or anything else. We can all say that we were joking and "quiet Bosnia".

3. They aren't in Europe for a start! - That was totally unnecessary. I said if they were in Europe not that they are in Europe. And my point was - read carefully - one national team can't be considered as a top quality team because they have qualified for WC. A lot of quality teams can't even make to WC because for example in Europe competition is way tougher. Some other continents are easier to qualify from.

4. I'm not comparing Eduardo and Crouch. I didn't say Crouch is scoring against poor teams. I didn't say Uruguay and Greece are poor teams. Anything else??

5. 20% is actually a relative number. It doesn't matter how many goals were scored. It shows how many goals had one footballer scored compared to a total number of goals.

From my post here - "I'm not blaming him for not scoring more. I'm just saying that his logic isn't right. England scored 5 so 1 Crouch's goal is great because it is 20% of all England goals. One goal is one goal. It is a goal but it isn't much." it was impossible for an average person to conclude that i think 20% is bad! Again it was not the point.

Why are you emphasizing it was 1 out of 5??:confused: What are you trying to say??

If Suker scored 1 goal it would have been 1 out of 6. So what?? What does it mean?? He scored 5 more so it is 6 of 11. If crouch scored say 4 goals it would be 4 out of 8.

But you don't seem to understand what I was trying to say here. And not just here but your conclusions on my posts are almost all wrong. I don't want to waste my time anymore on discussing with you because you are either joking or completely failing to understand me - which wouldn't be so bad if you asked for explanations. But you are not. You just make unreasonable conclusions and then reply to what you think I was saying.

1. Ok...you did that after your earlier reply to me, in which you mentioned something about Suker, and his goals in the WC, so thought you were comparing? :confused: I rate him and emphasize him because i like him as a footballer? Just like you do with many players, anything wrong with that? I Agree with the comparison thing...

2. I care what i have to say, thats all that matters to me :) If your going to through a fit at me for voicing my point then go ahead, i wont try to stop you.

3. That reply wasnt directed towards you...directed at Tim who said Crouch scores his goals vs poor countries, ok?

4. I am emphasizing that 1 in 5, consider 1 was an O.G. and think 1 was a pen, is not really that bad compared to team mates, if he managed 2 in 10 it would have looked a worse off percentage.

Your not the only guy i reply to, i reply to most peoples, if mine to you dont suit you, then fine by me, i guess your right, there seems to be a misunderstanding between us 2 and it should stay that way :)

Think that RVP and new signing Eduardo could potentially be better then they are just by the midfield of Fabregas' date=' Hleb and Rosicky, who IMO are three of the best passers in the EPL. Arsenal will still be a major force this season, everyone panicking at the departure of Henry, but look at the squad he was playing with, RVP is just another fine example of that.[/quote']

They could be...still doubt they will get anywhere big without another creative midfielder, and it depends how RVP gets on this year, 1 by staying fit and 2 his contribution of goals.

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

just to add 1 more thing in for Crouch... talk about his goals all you like but can you remember him missing many?

the service in the WC was awfull we hardly created anything at all which would also explain the lack of any goals not just crouch's

im sure we can all agree Shearer was an amazing goal scorer... how many goals would he have gotten without the excellent service he got?

Crouch isnt close to Shearer not saying he us but im sure you get my meaning... main bit is England + Sven + Mclown all s_uck

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

Back with van Persie and Arsenal' date=' I believe the Dutchman will become a key key key figure for Arsenal, especially since Henry has gone. IMO, he doesnt really need a strike partner; he can do the job well on his own. However, if Wenger comes back to his senses and decides to play Rosicky in his preferred AM position, behind van Persie preferably, then the two could blossom and become one of the most feared attacking pairs in the country.[/quote']

If Arsene Wenger had the senses that you gave him then that would be stupid :P why have 1 up front when you have potentially 5 strikers in.. Adebayor,eduardo,Van Persie,Bendtner,Walcott. If anyone i reckon he could be trying something new. Maybe a 4-3-3 who knows what goes on in his head :D But i do agree Rosicky does play better as an AM. But 1st of all Arsenal need a proper winger to replace him then maybe we'll see him in his true position.

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

As for this thread, for the Arsenal fan that created it. Its kind of gone wrong because forum wise remove the Arsenal and Liverpool fans (because they will probably both vote for there own anyway) votes and its pretty 1 sided in favour of Torres... in fact I can only see 1 non Arsenal fan on there although I could be wrong

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

Is van persie really a F/W...Everytime I've seen him play he plays just as a F, I have never seen him play as a winger. It's really annoying in the game because you cant really play him anywhere.If you play him as a Winger you only get an average of 6 rating from him and if you play him as a forward you only get 6 out of him. Has this happened to everyone or just me. I have him for a few of my clubs and the result is the same all the time.

Wayne Rooney should be a F/W or F/LM.

And ronaldinho should have his ratings decreased to about 95/96. Kaka is way better than ronnie.

Sorry, I changed the subject, this was meant to about comparing torres and van persie but they are nothing like each other, besides the fact that they are amazing finishers.

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

If Arsene Wenger had the senses that you gave him then that would be stupid :P why have 1 up front when you have potentially 5 strikers in.. Adebayor' date='eduardo,Van Persie,Bendtner,Walcott. If anyone i reckon he could be trying something new. Maybe a 4-3-3 who knows what goes on in his head :D But i do agree Rosicky does play better as an AM. But 1st of all Arsenal need a proper winger to replace him then maybe we'll see him in his true position.[/quote']

Bendtner and Walcott are far too young to be playing a big serious part for Arsenal this season. Trust me. The only competitions they are likely to feature regularly in are the domestic cups, and a few Premiership matches. Besides, Walcott usually plays as a winger anyway.

Adebayor needs 18 chances to score one, so surely he cannot be a first choice player can he?

Eduardo still has to settle...and this has been discussed a lot. That leaves van Persie, and Arsenal can still play a 4-4-1-1 with Rosicky behind. Its better than having Adebayor and van Persie upfront and Rosicky on the left.

Is van persie really a F/W...Everytime I've seen him play he plays just as a F' date=' I have never seen him play as a winger. It's really annoying in the game because you cant really play him anywhere.If you play him as a Winger you only get an average of 6 rating from him and if you play him as a forward you only get 6 out of him. Has this happened to everyone or just me. I have him for a few of my clubs and the result is the same all the time.

Wayne Rooney should be a F/W or F/LM.

And ronaldinho should have his ratings decreased to about 95/96. Kaka is way better than ronnie.

Sorry, I changed the subject, this was meant to about comparing torres and van persie but they are nothing like each other, besides the fact that they are amazing finishers.[/quote']

He plays as a winger for Holland...so does van der Vaart and Robben...

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

What u mean adebayor needs 18 chances to score 1. He's quality. On soccer Am they were comparing him to drogba. I seen him play loads of times last season and he looks good. Next season he might even increase to 90/91.

I havent seen eduardo silva play so i cannot comment on him but if arsenal paid 16million then he must be quality considering arsenal dont like to spend much.

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

just to add 1 more thing in for Crouch... talk about his goals all you like but can you remember him missing many?

the service in the WC was awfull we hardly created anything at all which would also explain the lack of any goals not just crouch's

im sure we can all agree Shearer was an amazing goal scorer... how many goals would he have gotten without the excellent service he got?

Crouch isnt close to Shearer not saying he us but im sure you get my meaning... main bit is England + Sven + Mclown all s_uck

ok, i will never be a fan of crouch, however, i can concede that he can score goals in the premiership, but he will never be prolific. also, he can be a handful to the very best of defences, and he showed this against milan, and worldclass defender nesta, to be fair, he changed the game when he came on.

As for eduardo, he has shown he can be prolific, in the croatian league, which is not as good as any major league, but he fully deserves his 90 for his performances for the croatian national team. when he goes to arsenal, he may struggle at the start, but i have no doubts that he will prove a success for them, and quickly make people forget about henry.

by the way, could we now stop talking about crouch, either make a new thread or start talking about torres or van persie.

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

ok' date=' i will never be a fan of crouch, however, i can concede that he can score goals in the premiership, but he will never be prolific. also, [b']he can be a handful to the very best of defences, and he showed this against milan, and worldclass defender nesta, to be fair, he changed the game when he came on[/b].

As for eduardo, he has shown he can be prolific, in the croatian league, which is not as good as any major league, but he fully deserves his 90 for his performances for the croatian national team. when he goes to arsenal, he may struggle at the start, but i have no doubts that he will prove a success for them, and quickly make people forget about henry.

by the way, could we now stop talking about crouch, either make a new thread or start talking about torres or van persie.

stop talking about Crouch now u admit we were right sure (although this thread aint about aduardo either ;) ).

by we were right i mean you just gave Crouch all the stats me and nav were talking about, none of us said he was prolific hes not supposed to be thats not the type of striker he is.

hes supposed to do all those things you just mentioned what i have made bold.

As for eduardo I agree with you their after he settles down he probably will be a big hit

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

ok' date=' i will never be a fan of crouch, however, i can concede that he can score goals in the premiership, but he will never be prolific. also, he can be a handful to the very best of defences, and he showed this against milan, and worldclass defender nesta, to be fair, he changed the game when he came on. [/quote']

:confused: ......are you saying that you will never be a fan of Crouch, but you concede that he scores goals and comes on and changes games, like the one you stated, the Champions league final (the biggest club football final), against World class defenders like Nesta, and possibly the best side on the planet in AC Milan ?

So are you a fan of Crouch, or are you just hating Crouch due to this debate, but really like the way he changes games and scores goals ? :confused:

You can't argue a point that Crouch is a bad player and never performs against quality opposition, and then praise him for performing well against quality opposition ?!?

But you are right Tim, the thread is about RVP vs Torres, and Liverpool are facing Werder Bremen tonight, and i'm really looking forward to seeing Torres tonight, although you won't see the best of him, and will probably play just half a game, will be worth the watch. :)

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

You can't argue a point that Crouch is a bad player and never performs against quality opposition' date=' and then praise him for performing well against quality opposition ?!?

[/quote']

He tried to prove that he is no good. But in the end admitted that Crouch isn't bad but he just doesn't like him. IMO

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

How can he prove that he's no good' date=' then concede that he is good ?

He's just contradicting his point.[/quote']

True. But if you simply don't like somebody you may try to find excuses for that. It didn't pass, people here proved him wrong and he admitted that Crouch might be good but he doesn't like him anyway. I'm not his lawyer or something, I just think that is the answer.B)

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

True. But if you simply don't like somebody you may try to find excuses for that. It didn't pass' date=' people here proved him wrong and he admitted that Crouch might be good but he doesn't like him anyway. I'm not his lawyer or something, I just think that is the answer.B)[/quote']

Lol. :D :D

I know you are not his lawyer, nor representing or backing him up, i think if you was his lawyer, you would be demanding top-dollar, because you would have to convince virtually every forumer on here :D :D

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

Lol. :D :D

I know you are not his lawyer' date=' nor representing or backing him up, i think if you was his lawyer, you would be demanding top-dollar, because you would have to convince virtually every forumer on here :D :D[/quote']

Laughing Out Loud:D

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Re: Robin Van Persie vs Fernando Torres

Im sitting here wondering how a thread titled 'Fernando Torres vs Robin van Persie' ends up with Zazoon becoming a lawyer...

:D :D

Yeah, you are probably right m8. But one thing lead to another...

Besides this thread was condemned to end like this from the start. Especially after those verbal "fights" on Arsenal gossip.

Conclusion:

Off topic - Crouch isn't bad, Eduardo isn't bad, we can't compare them atm.

On topic - Torres is quality, RvP is Quality - we can't compare them atm.

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