Jump to content

Bundesliga Ratings Discussion


Recommended Posts

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

Your an expert at using the Fallacy of Abuse pal ;)

Fabregas aside' date=' at least were on the same page that Muller should be a 95.

Bundesliga concerned, that's all that matters in regards to this debate.[/quote']

I personally rather fancy the fallacy of Personal Attack, but hey, you did raise a fair point; no disagreements on Müller, and that's all that matters.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 8.5k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion Bayern München NEUER, Manuel GK 95 ⇒ 95 REINA, Pepe GK 91 ⇘ 91/90 STARKE, Tom GK 87 ⇘ 87/86 LAHM, Philipp D(RL),DM(RLC) 95 ⇒ 95 ALABA, David D,DM(L),M(LC) 93 ⇗

Ratings 2012/2013 by timesle I talked to Phil recently and he told me that he is not going to make a new prediction thread for the next rating changes. Of course these are bad news for the whole for

Re: Bundesliga Ratings 2012/2013 Updated: December 14th, 2012 Goalkeeper Risers Marc-André TER STEGEN 87 => 88 / 89 Bernd LENO 87 => 88 Kevin TRAPP 86 => 87 Sebast

Posted Images

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

I believe some players like Fabregas & De Rossi always had their actual ratings. They were both top players when this game started, so they deservedly got a pretty high rating. They did nothing particularly wrong to justify a drop, so they kept their ratings until today. They should not be used as an example, as they achieved their ratings in a completely different way.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

look guys, as what maxpayne said below,

We couldnt compare old & new rating systems

SM seems to be more generous between 2008-2012

many "average" players got high rated at that time,

for example :

1. Gilardino hit 93 in 2010, he has been good in serie A, after an awful 3 years at milan

but why immobile only hit 89 last year? 4point behind gilardino in 2010?

2. dont take my words on wrong way, but in now rating system, gerrard in prime wont ever hit 97,

gerrard is superb, but 97 is really something, its iniesta rating, being good in a team is not enough, u should win a lot of trophies, and also nominated in baloon d'or

3. Milito hit 95 in 2010, ok inter won trebles, but his performance in now rating system definitely is not 95 standard

then why mandzukic just hit 91-92 after the treble?

4. Fabregas wont hit his 95 in now rating system, he has been good, but winning no trophies and didnt win any BPL best player(like bale & suarez) didnt convince me much to get 95, maybe he deserves 94 and 50-50 to rise to 95 this review, but i think he will rise in the end if chelsea finished well

Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

look guys' date=' as what maxpayne said below,

[b']We couldnt compare old & new rating systems[/b]

SM seems to be more generous between 2008-2012

many "average" players got high rated at that time,

for example :

1. Gilardino hit 93 in 2010, he has been good in serie A, after an awful 3 years at milan

but why immobile only hit 89 last year? 4point behind gilardino in 2010?

2. dont take my words on wrong way, but in now rating system, gerrard in prime wont ever hit 97,

gerrard is superb, but 97 is really something, its iniesta rating, being good in a team is not enough, u should win a lot of trophies, and also nominated in baloon d'or

3. Milito hit 95 in 2010, ok inter won trebles, but his performance in now rating system definitely is not 95 standard

then why mandzukic just hit 91-92 after the treble?

4. Fabregas wont hit his 95 in now rating system, he has been good, but winning no trophies and didnt win any BPL best player(like bale & suarez) didnt convince me much to get 95, maybe he deserves 94 and 50-50 to rise to 95 this review, but i think he will rise in the end if chelsea finished well

You forget that these things are built up over time. Gilardino was good for a few years then he won the world cup. Immobile has had one break out season. Fabregas was also one of Barcelona's best players last year. You can't expect a player doing well one season to just increase instantaneously, incase he doesn't do it the next.

Apologies, i've just read it again and realised you're posting someone elses words.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

4. Fabregas wont hit his 95 in now rating system' date=' he has been good, but winning no trophies and didnt win any BPL best player(like bale & suarez) didnt convince me much to get 95, maybe he deserves 94 and 50-50 to rise to 95 this review, but i think he will rise in the end if chelsea finished well[/quote']

Totally disagree with you on Cesc. Why dont people think he deserved 95 with Arsenal?

The guy was amazing for us. Scoring alot from midfield, always top of the assist chart. Dominated games with his passing. Scoring big goals in CL and PL. Won Euro 2008 and WC 2010 with Spain. I know Arsenal won nothing (We went close to the league, league cup finals and CL semi) but he was easily the third best player in the country after Ronaldo and Gerrard. Could have got into any team when he was at his peak for Arsenal. No big personal awards (Although won PFA young player and consistantly nominated) I think a player should get a high rating if they are performing at that level, not there fault if the team isnt.

At Barca is was pretty good too (15 goals and 20 assists in first season...). Won titles, scored goals, then won Euro 2012. And still doing it with Chelsea. Hes well deserved that 95 for the amount of time hes had it.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

look guys' date=' as what maxpayne said below,

[b']We couldnt compare old & new rating systems[/b]

SM seems to be more generous between 2008-2012

many "average" players got high rated at that time,

for example :

1. Gilardino hit 93 in 2010, he has been good in serie A, after an awful 3 years at milan

but why immobile only hit 89 last year? 4point behind gilardino in 2010?

2. dont take my words on wrong way, but in now rating system, gerrard in prime wont ever hit 97,

gerrard is superb, but 97 is really something, its iniesta rating, being good in a team is not enough, u should win a lot of trophies, and also nominated in baloon d'or

3. Milito hit 95 in 2010, ok inter won trebles, but his performance in now rating system definitely is not 95 standard

then why mandzukic just hit 91-92 after the treble?

4. Fabregas wont hit his 95 in now rating system, he has been good, but winning no trophies and didnt win any BPL best player(like bale & suarez) didnt convince me much to get 95, maybe he deserves 94 and 50-50 to rise to 95 this review, but i think he will rise in the end if chelsea finished well

1. Gilardino was rather productive for Fiorentina for the years prior so he would eventually build to the rather generous rating

in comparison, Immobile only busted into the scene and gained attention last season, if we are to go by your idea we should be rating Pelle, Berahino, and Harry Kane in the low 90s...

3. perhaps because Mandzukic had only proven himself for only 2 seasons, look at the seasons before when he was at Wolfsburg which does not resemble a top rating

on the other hand, Milito was a very consistent, top scorer in the Italian and Spanish top divisions for Genoa and Zaragoza, overlooked by the top teams, with many 20+ goal seasons before Jose Mourinho signed him for his Inter side.

In treble winning season, he was absolutely crucial, a key element for the Inter side and scored goals when the club needed it most.

In fact, he scored the winning goals to secure Inter the Italian Cup, Serie A, and Champions League.

Tell me, did Mandzukic do that?

4. Disagree with you here too.

Fabregas IMO certainly deserves a 95.

Agreeing with others, he was crucial and a very top playmaker for Arsenal throughout the seasons. He did win trophies, Euro 2008 + 12, WC 2010, was in the Team of the Tournament for the both Euros, was named in several Team of the Years from 2006-10, then went to Barca where he did in my opinion great with fierce competition... at Chelsea, he is a key player in the middle of the park, still providing many clear cut chances for the likes of Diego Costa... just like he has for the past several years..

Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

You forget that these things are built up over time. Gilardino was good for a few years then he won the world cup. Immobile has had one break out season. Fabregas was also one of Barcelona's best players last year. You can't expect a player doing well one season to just increase instantaneously' date=' incase he doesn't do it the next.[/b']

Apologies, i've just read it again and realised you're posting someone elses words.

1, Gilardino was awful in his 3 years in milan, he rose to 93(2010) after just one good year with fiorentina, besides in 2006 world cup he just score 1 goal, so whats the point of 93? mandzukic meanwhile played in the best team, scored a lot of goals(bayern top scorer in 2 seasons and just 92), im not saying immobile deserve 93, but 4 point behind is ridicilous, thats why im saying rating systems are different nowadays

2. Fabregas was also one of Barcelona's best players last year? seriously? they sold him after being the best player? i admitted it was wrong decision of barca to sell him, but hey, if he was really that good in barca, did u think they will replace him with rakitic?

3. I posted whoelse posting? could u just grab it for the proof? ive mentioned it in another threads longtimeago

Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

1' date=' Gilardino was awful in his 3 years in milan, [b']he rose to 93(2010) after just one good year with fiorentina, besides in 2006 world cup he just score 1 goal, so whats the point of 93?[/b] mandzukic meanwhile played in the best team, scored a lot of goals(bayern top scorer in 2 seasons and just 92), im not saying immobile deserve 93, but 4 point behind is ridicilous, thats why im saying rating systems are different nowadays

2. Fabregas was also one of Barcelona's best players last year? seriously? they sold him after being the best player? i admitted it was wrong decision of barca to sell him, but hey, if he was really that good in barca, did u think they will replace him with rakitic?

3. I posted whoelse posting? could u just grab it for the proof? ive mentioned it in another threads longtimeago

I have no clue what the 2006 World Cup has on your 2010 rating, especially when the player (Gilardino) was rather consistent, and on the ascent in the seasons after the WC

Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

Totally disagree with you on Cesc. Why dont people think he deserved 95 with Arsenal?

The guy was amazing for us. Scoring alot from midfield' date=' always top of the assist chart. Dominated games with his passing. Scoring big goals in CL and PL. Won Euro 2008 and WC 2010 with Spain. I know Arsenal won nothing (We went close to the league, league cup finals and CL semi) but he was easily the third best player in the country after Ronaldo and Gerrard. Could have got into any team when he was at his peak for Arsenal. No big personal awards (Although won PFA young player and consistantly nominated) I think a player should get a high rating if they are performing at that level, not there fault if the team isnt.

At Barca is was pretty good too (15 goals and 20 assists in first season...). Won titles, scored goals, then won Euro 2012. And still doing it with Chelsea. Hes well deserved that 95 for the amount of time hes had it.[/quote']

1. Gilardino was rather productive for Fiorentina for the years prior so he would eventually build to the rather generous rating

in comparison' date=' Immobile only busted into the scene and gained attention last season, if we are to go by your idea we should be rating Pelle, Berahino, and Harry Kane in the low 90s...

3. perhaps because Mandzukic had only proven himself for only 2 seasons, look at the seasons before when he was at Wolfsburg which does not resemble a top rating

on the other hand, Milito was a very consistent, top scorer in the Italian and Spanish top divisions for Genoa and Zaragoza, overlooked by the top teams, with many 20+ goal seasons before Jose Mourinho signed him for his Inter side.

In treble winning season, he was absolutely crucial, a key element for the Inter side and scored goals when the club needed it most.

In fact, he scored the winning goals to secure Inter the Italian Cup, Serie A, and Champions League.

Tell me, did Mandzukic do that?

4. Disagree with you here too.

Fabregas IMO certainly deserves a 95.

Agreeing with others, he was crucial and a very top playmaker for Arsenal throughout the seasons. He did win trophies, Euro 2008 + 12, WC 2010, was in the Team of the Tournament for the both Euros, was named in several Team of the Years from 2006-10, then went to Barca where he did in my opinion great with fierce competition... at Chelsea, he is a key player in the middle of the park, still providing many clear cut chances for the likes of Diego Costa... just like he has for the past several years..[/quote']

okay, everyone has everyone's opinion,

i think my point is fabregas is right, but maybe im wrong, fair enough

my point is

Old Rating Systems are totally different with New Rating Systems

in old, SM is pretty generous

there are more example that i couldnt mention here

but as you know, that is my point, stop comparing old rating with new rating players

Muller will sure for 100% rise to 95 or maybe 96 in old rating systems, seriously muller won everything in bayern and did the world cup, when milito just did better in several years in zaragoza,genoa and treble with inter for one season

(or maybe u guys think milito is better than muller?)

Bale will sure rise to 95 at least in old rating systems, he proved himself quite much in spurs before did the la decima in madrid right?

immobile will sure at least rise to 90 last review

mandzukic to 93,

etc

and in that time, maybe u guys will say, muller deserves 96, bale deserves his 95 etc

Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

I have no clue what the 2006 World Cup has on your 2010 rating' date=' especially when the player (Gilardino) was rather consistent, and on the ascent in the seasons after the WC[/quote']

ask OhSholaAmeobi for that, u can read the thread below

its him mention 2006 world cup has the relate point with his 93

Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

2. Fabregas was also one of Barcelona's best players last year? seriously? they sold him after being the best player? i admitted it was wrong decision of barca to sell him' date=' but hey, if he was really that good in barca, did u think they will replace him with rakitic?

[/quote']

Its the first time that a top team sells one of his best players? Not too long ago the same team dispatched Ibrahimovic. For christ sake Real sold Di Maria, after being definitely one of their best players, only second to Ronaldo in the team, and Ozil the season before.

A team can sell one of their best players for numerous reasons, from wanting to cash in to problems in the backstage or simply tactical decision (new manager).

Oh yeah, and Rakitic has nothing on Fabregas, he's a good player, sure, but nowhere near his level. And if you want to name a replacement to Fabregas departure, would be more Suarez than Rakitic.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

You have to be kidding right ?

Fabregas got 95 at Arsenal for winning absolute nothing. He was a passenger during his stay at Barcelona. Regardless of the Barcelona esqu possession game Arsenal played at that time' date=' 95 is generous for a player who didn't win any major trophy.

Granted he played a prominent role in Euro 2012 and the respective WC win, but he in comparison to Muller and Bale he didn't achieve anything at club level to warrant such a rating.

Muller on the other hand has been an important cog in a Bayern side that has

been to 3 Champions League Finals in the last year, a treble winning side followed by a domestic double, coupled with the fact he won the golden boot at 2010 World while picking up the Silver Boot in 2014 as Germany won the World Cup.

He deserves his 95.

Bale on the other hand had it not been for injuries this season, could have also staked a strong claim for 95. In his first season he won the double, the Champions League and the Spanish Cup, scoring in both finals.

In regards to Gotze, over the past two seasons he has been better than Ozil both in terms of contribution and silverware. Personally think Ozil should be dropping to 93 because he has been very average, particularly in comparison to Gotze. 94 or 93 Gotze should be equal to Ozil.[/quote']

Bla bla bla, bla bla bla! Stopped taking you seriously after the second sentence, that is definitely from a guy that knows nothing of the time that Fabregas played for barça!

Trophies are just one variable of the rating system, the main being Performance and Talent! This is not a trophy count, but a rating of players abilities.

Anyway, both Gotze and Muller will get their rise on the end of the season probably.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

Yall realise Cesc only got 94 at Arsenal and got 95 at Barcelona right. Cause i have seen 'Cesc getting 95 at Arsenal" 5 times on the last page and its completely inaccurate.

Hmmm, are you sure? Soccerwiki shows that he was 95 at Arsenal, at least is what i can make of that Amazing historical.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

Its the first time that a top team sells one of his best players? Not too long ago the same team dispatched Ibrahimovic. For christ sake Real sold Di Maria' date=' after being definitely one of their best players, only second to Ronaldo in the team, and Ozil the season before.

A team can sell one of their best players for numerous reasons, from wanting to cash in to problems in the backstage or simply tactical decision (new manager).

Oh yeah, and Rakitic has nothing on Fabregas, he's a good player, sure, but nowhere near his level. And if you want to name a replacement to Fabregas departure, would be more Suarez than Rakitic.[/quote']

Fabregas is sold, not because Barca need money, Barca intend to upgrade him, like upgrading Sanchez with Suarez, Barca intend to replace Fabregas with Rakitic, its really a bad decision though

My point is, Barca didnt value him too much, as the team officially said he was really poor at the end of season, regardless how good he was at the beginning

I believe, if we are talking in August, and somebody ask :

Reus or Fabregas

Suarez or Fabregas

Di Maria or Fabregas

or even

Koke or Fabregas

majority of us wont choose Fabregas

but now things are different

Its maybe not true, but i believe he never perform his 95 at barcelona,

btw, fabregas got his 95 in 2008, before he moved to barcelona

and like i mention before, old rating system is more generous

Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

Hmmm' date=' are you sure? Soccerwiki shows that he was 95 at Arsenal, at least is what i can make of that Amazing historical.[/quote']

could be i am wrong, i dont use that SW rubbihs and the ingame shows no history for him for some reason. I was sure he got the 95 at barcelona but maybe i am wrong.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

Fabregas is sold' date=' not because Barca need money, Barca intend to upgrade him, like upgrading Suarez with Sanchez, Barca intend to replace Fabregas with Rakitic, its really a bad decision though

My point is, Barca didnt value him too much, as the team officially said he was really poor at the end of season, regardless how good he was at the beginning

I believe, if we are talking in [b']August[/b], and somebody ask :

Reus or Fabregas

Suarez or Fabregas

Di Maria or Fabregas

or even

Koke or Fabregas

majority of us wont choose Fabregas

but now things are different

Its maybe not true, but i believe he never perform his 95 at barcelona,

btw, fabregas got his 95 in 2008, before he moved to barcelona

and like i mention before, old rating system is more generous

Yeah, forgot about Sanchez, but anyway Barca kinda needed the money mainly because of Suarez and FFP. Not saying that they only sold him because of it or anything but it was one of the reasons for sure.

At the end of the season all barca was poor and then all spain too, and not only fabregas, maybe he was the escape goat, dunno.

But i forgot this is bundesliga thread and i won't speak more of this here.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

could be i am wrong' date=' i dont use that SW rubbihs and the ingame shows no history for him for some reason. I was sure he got the 95 at barcelona but maybe i am wrong.[/quote']

Nein he got it at Arsenal.

Also, Barca only sold him because only in form players have Barca DNA and are welcomed home.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

Totally disagree with you on Cesc. Why dont people think he deserved 95 with Arsenal?

The guy was amazing for us. Scoring alot from midfield' date=' always top of the assist chart. Dominated games with his passing. Scoring big goals in CL and PL. Won Euro 2008 and WC 2010 with Spain. I know Arsenal won nothing (We went close to the league, league cup finals and CL semi) but he was easily the third best player in the country after Ronaldo and Gerrard. Could have got into any team when he was at his peak for Arsenal. No big personal awards (Although won PFA young player and consistantly nominated) I think a player should get a high rating if they are performing at that level, not there fault if the team isnt.

At Barca is was pretty good too (15 goals and 20 assists in first season...). Won titles, scored goals, then won Euro 2012. And still doing it with Chelsea. Hes well deserved that 95 for the amount of time hes had it.[/quote']

Agree,but Lampard was pretty good around that time too. Why was Gerrard better??

Link to post
Share on other sites

Re: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

Anyone any idea how Firmino is doing this season??

Dude, this is the 'we all dream of a world in which we agree on all ratings of all players and until that time we shall have pointless repetitious arguments over it' thread, not really the right place to ask that question don't you think........

Link to post
Share on other sites

Riferimento: Bundesliga Ratings Discussion

SM is engaging in great efforts for player review: only a player every day :D

Two day ago ONLY Boateng

Yesterday ONLY Alan

Today ONLY De Bruyne

WOW, fantastic.

Three weeks for Bundesliga review and still has not been completed: Sule, Goetze, Muller, Leno, Son, Perisic, Arnold and more... :rolleyes:

Come on SM, come on.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

×
×
  • Create New...