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Official Manchester United Thread


Rishabh Desai
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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

He has 8 goals for England and 4 of them were against the world beaters San Marino and Moldova' date=' 3 of them in friendlies against Belgium, Sweden and Scotland and 1 vs Sweden in Euro 2012... plus the 1 goal in the 2012-13 season in the 27 games he played[/quote']

Quite the poacher.

So I imagine your opinion changes often? Are you Piers Morgan by any chance?

And besides' date=' if you don't look "deeper", there is no such thing as "potential", hence everything should be labelled as "luck", which isn't the case, as you even showed by defending the Ramsey-case.[/quote']

It hardly ever changes actually. It either takes an event of immense magnitude or a period of significant time to alter my view point.

Ramsey is not even comparable to Welly. He was showing top class talent at the age of 18/19.

I've not contradicted myself in the slightest. Contradicting myself would be "oh no, Danny Welbeck is a fine player who serves a purpose every time he plays".

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

Quite the poacher.

It hardly ever changes actually. It either takes an event of immense magnitude or a period of significant time to alter my view point.

Ramsey is not even comparable to Welly. He was showing top class talent at the age of 18/19.

I've not contradicted myself in the slightest. Contradicting myself would be "oh no' date=' Danny Welbeck is a fine player who serves a purpose every time he plays".[/quote']

Which is the reason why almost every Arsenal fan wanted him out until a year ago? And sure, now you're going to tell me that you knew that he'd be a success one day.

And the contradiction is when you called Ramsey a "talent", which according to your logic, shouldn't be allowed.

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

Which is the reason why almost every Arsenal fan wanted him out until a year ago? And sure' date=' now you're going to tell me that you knew that he'd be a success one day.

And the contradiction is when you called Ramsey a "talent", which according to your logic, shouldn't be allowed.[/quote']

He proved me wrong and i'm glad he did.

You can call someone a talent when it's justified. You're beating around the bush with a player that, even if he did improve, would still fall miles below the standard United should be looking for. I hope, for your sake, that LVG doesn't dilly dally as much because waiting for players to kick on can be a fatal mistake. Welbeck's gone past the age for real improvement.

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

He has 8 goals for England and 4 of them were against the world beaters San Marino and Moldova' date=' 3 of them in friendlies against Belgium, Sweden and Scotland and 1 vs Sweden in Euro 2012... plus the 1 goal in the 2012-13 season in the 27 games he played[/quote']

All of those United games, and a lot of his England games, were from the wing. I'll happily state that Welbeck is an abhorrent winger who would barely be of Premier League standard. He is, however, a decent striker IMO.

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

I think that you selling Welbeck could work out similarly to Chelsea selling Sturridge. Both young' date=' homegrown players who haven't been trusted in their best position and could well excel elsewhere if played there.[/quote']

Definitely agree on this, Welbeck given a run in upfront would be a very good PL striker. He is very intelligent in his movements and decisions too but all these armchair experts from other clubs don't see him play and judge him based on goals which isn't fair to judge him on based on being played out wide. Whenever he's played through the middle he's been excellent at United offering so much to the attack and the pace we've been so lacking!

His problem is that Rooney and RVP even if underperforming are on such high wages and are so important to the United image of 'world class' that it's hard for any manager to take the chance and give him the games upfront which is a shame.

I would hate to see him at any PL club because he's someone who could turn out to bite us in the bum. At worst we could loan him out to Everton but nothing more than that IMO.

only small clubs with less talented strikers would play him in his position. No one's gonna play him ahead when they already have RVP' date=' Rooney and Chicha. And if he really has potential like you say then loaning him out is the best decision IMO.[/quote']

I could understand us loaning him like Chelsea have with Lukaku and there would be plenty of suitors too.

Liverpool bought Sturridge from Chelsea and then finished ahead of them with him playing up front. Spurs and Everton both finished above you last season and both would probably start Welbeck up front. He wouldn't accept a loan move either. He's old enough for you to make a decision one way or another. Buying RVP has really screwed over both Welbeck and Hernandez.

I'd agree while the best thing for the club might be to loan him I can't see Welbeck wanting to stick around and wait another year to be given games in a United shirt.

Buying RVP was a necessary evil. We needed some world class talent in the squad and he was available for a decent fee IMO. It got us another title and under Van Gaal you'd expect RVP to hit top form again and tbf to him he's not really had a bad season 18 goals and 3 assists in 28 games isn't a bad return considering his injuries. However like you say it's had a negative impact on the younger strikers Welbeck and Hernandez.

At the end of the day none of this really matters though, we've got James Wilson ;)

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

interesting people slating welbeck and milner.

milner i don't see why he is a bad player at all, maybe Stuart can either agree with me or disagree (im genuinely interested if i am right on this or not) but from what i have seen, milner has been vital for city this season.

he has popped up with vital goals, good assists and is reliable when he does play. he may not be a key player but id go as far as saying he has had a very important part of city's sucesses and has had a good season.

7 assists in the league, 1 goal and 1 + 4 in the UCL is deceptive, i think overall he has been decent and id like to know what you think on this Stu.

as for welbeck, 83 starts and 28 goals.

a goal in 3 which aint bad considering he has been used as a winger a lot.

he was also uniteds best player against bayern, yes he missed a 1v1 but he was the only one offering any goal threat against them and did more than anybody else did tbh.

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

interesting people slating welbeck and milner.

milner i don't see why he is a bad player at all' date=' maybe Stuart can either agree with me or disagree (im genuinely interested if i am right on this or not) but from what i have seen, milner has been vital for city this season.

he has popped up with vital goals, good assists and is reliable when he does play. he may not be a key player but id go as far as saying he has had a very important part of city's sucesses and has had a good season.

7 assists in the league, 1 goal and 1 + 4 in the UCL is deceptive, i think overall he has been decent and id like to know what you think on this Stu.

as for welbeck, 83 starts and 28 goals.

a goal in 3 which aint bad considering he has been used as a winger a lot.

he was also uniteds best player against bayern, yes he missed a 1v1 but he was the only one offering any goal threat against them and did more than anybody else did tbh.[/quote']

I think Milner's great. His workrate is phenomenal and his output is far better than others would lead you to believe. He's changed a fair few games this season such as Fulham and Liverpool away (we'd have taken points from the latter were it not for a howler from Kompany) which could be argued as crucial.

I don't think he's a key player, but we'd miss him if we didn't have him.

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

Papers are linking United to Marquinhos and W Carvalho again

I don't see Marquinhos going to United tbh.

PSG spent a fortune on him, a year ago, and I find it hard to believe PSG would sell him for a smaller fee.

William's move, I find believable. And, from my point of view, you guys wouldn't regret it. It's not because I'm Portuguese. I can tell you right now that Nani is useless atm. He has quality, but you should sell him, as it would benefit the club and the player imo.

As for William, I'm not saying he'll be a world beater right from the get go.

He's pretty good, though: he's super strong, great in aerial play and has very good technique: he can make long passes and you don't get that often in a DM.

I just think he has to improve a bit, in tactical aspects (positioning and marking).

It's a real shame Fergie is no longer at United.

I believe he was the most important person in Ronaldo's professional career and, for me, William would progress immensely under his leadership.

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

I think Milner's great. His workrate is phenomenal and his output is far better than others would lead you to believe. He's changed a fair few games this season such as Fulham and Liverpool away (we'd have taken points from the latter were it not for a howler from Kompany) which could be argued as crucial.

I don't think he's a key player' date=' but we'd miss him if we didn't have him.[/quote']

won't dwell on this too much because it is the united threat but im glad you said that, means im not totally losing the plot afterall.

I think the only people that criticize milner only do so because he doesn't throw temper tantrums and actually works hard..

i think its the same with welbeck, just because he has those qualities people say it is all he can do.

I think for england anyway, he would be 3rd choice after sturridge, rooney (who isnt a pure striker) and then id have welbeck.

again maybe thats just be but for the upcoming WC he'd be my next choice for CF.

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

Danny Welbeck should put in a transfer request and get the hell out of the club before we turn him into a more talented, attacking version of O'Shea. We've treated him terribly over the last 2 seasons and both Fergie and Moyes have to take the blame. Fergie for signing RVP when he wasn't needed and Moyes for dropping Welbeck as soon as Rooney or RVP became fit despite him doing quite well when he did start.

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

Danny Welbeck should put in a transfer request and get the hell out of the club before we turn him into a more talented' date=' attacking version of O'Shea. We've treated him terribly over the last 2 seasons and both Fergie and Moyes have to take the blame. [b']Fergie for signing RVP when he wasn't needed[/b] and Moyes for dropping Welbeck as soon as Rooney or RVP became fit despite him doing quite well when he did start.

RVP helped United win the title that year

Welbeck is a great player, people criticised his goal scoring but he has improved on in, my only problems which I hope Van Gaal can get out of him is Composure and taking the gamble, he does hesitate at times

He will stay, he still has a future at United, I just think he wants more game time

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

Danny Welbeck should put in a transfer request and get the hell out of the club before we turn him into a more talented' date=' attacking version of O'Shea. We've treated him terribly over the last 2 seasons and both Fergie and Moyes have to take the blame. Fergie for signing RVP when he wasn't needed and Moyes for dropping Welbeck as soon as Rooney or RVP became fit despite him doing quite well when he did start.[/quote']

RVP was not needed???

He won you a Premier League through his performances and goals, now I like Welbeck and think he has a lot to offer but stick him up front that season instead of Van Persie and you don't win the League.....simple as that

He ain't anywhere near RVP class....

Where I will agree is that he needs to move, he ain't ever gunna get a chance to be a striker in the literal sense at United, he should perhaps take a step backwards in terms of club to take a step forward for his own sake and have regular football something he has been dearly lacking in recent years.

If he is to fulfill his potential he needs to be playing regular simple as he has to give himself a chance I can understand his frustrations.

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

RVP was not needed???

He won you a Premier League through his performances and goals' date=' now I like Welbeck and think he has a lot to offer but stick him up front that season instead of Van Persie and you don't win the League.....simple as that

He ain't anywhere near RVP class....

Where I will agree is that he needs to move, he ain't ever gunna get a chance to be a striker in the literal sense at United, he should perhaps take a step backwards in terms of club to take a step forward for his own sake and have regular football something he has been dearly lacking in recent years.

If he is to fulfill his potential he needs to be playing regular simple as he has to give himself a chance I can understand his frustrations.[/quote']

No, he wasn't needed. We had already gotten Kagawa (another one who wasn't helped by RVP's signing) and already had 3 strikers at the club. Just like we didn't need Mata this season. Quality players but not the players we needed.

We finished on the same points total the season before we signed RVP and that was after the almighty bottle job. And that was with Welbeck up top with Rooney for most of the season. 12 goals in his first full season at United was a good haul and his performances kept on improving as the season went on. Towards the end he was very much looking like a Manchester United striker and instead of banking on him to push and improve further we relegated him to third choice.

And it's not a question of replacing Welbeck with RVP or saying he's good as the Dutchman (he isn't and it would have been Rooney doing bulk of the scoring instead of RVP). Signing RVP affected all of Rooney, Welbeck, Hernandez and Kagawa. We'd have gotten more out of all of them and cumulatively that would made a difference.

So incredibly frustrating. Best striker we've produced since Mark Hughes and we've thrown it away. Urgh!

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

RVP was needed, he was absolutely class in his first season. Ferguson knew it was his last season and wanted to go out at all costs as a Champion (again)hence spending a rather large fee on a player with only a few good years (injuries permitting) left.

If Fergie was younger he would of bought another (much) younger striker who could contribute to his dynasty for many more years.

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

RVP was needed' date=' he was absolutely class in his first season. Ferguson knew it was his last season and wanted to go out at all costs as a Champion (again)hence spending a rather large fee on a player with only a few good years (injuries permitting) left.

If Fergie was younger he would of bought another (much) younger striker who could contribute to his dynasty for many more years.[/quote']

You didn't need a striker at all. A solid central midfielder and you'd have probably still won the title, and been set for the future.

FYI, you scored 89 goals in 2011/12 without RVP and 86 a year later with him.

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

Ah so basing it all around. Bunch if hypotheticals hardly the greatest argument is it???

The reality is RVP almost single handedly at times got you that title, his goals were the decisive factor and nobody in any fit state would argue that Hernandez, Welbeck or Kagawa could have produced to the extent he did both in terms of goals and performances.

Old Bacon Face was not silly he saw what what was required and went out Nd got the one thing that could wrestle the title away...

I think it is dillusional to think without RVP you would have won the title that season, the cracks were already appearing in the other areas and only his goals saved you...

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

You didn't need a striker at all. A solid central midfielder and you'd have probably still won the title' date=' and been set for the future.

FYI, you scored 89 goals in 2011/12 without RVP and 86 a year later with him.[/quote']

I don't need him :P (Can't stand United)

Comparing goal totals from different seasons is like comparing apples and oranges.

The simple fact is he scored against every big team (I am counting my Reds, Liverpool in there who he scored against in both games, one a game winning penalty)

Also picked up the points with hat tricks against Aston Villa and Southampton (which United were losing 2-1).

Injury time winner to beat City

These are the deceives ones, he bagged another 17 I haven't mentioned.

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

I'd rather have not signed RVP and spent the money elsewhere. Our transfer dealings over the last few years has been horrendous.

Players bought in have been shocking and players we've missed out on is depressing to think about.

We needed a world class signing. Ideally at CM but there was nobody about that fitted the bill. RVP wasn't a shocking signing he was an excellent one' date=' he won us the league.

However I completely understand the argument that a top quality CM could have had a similar impact in terms of helping us win games.

RVP was and is still a world class striker, he's had a good season this year injuries considered and while he's resulted in a few unhappy campers (Chico and Welbeck) the quality he brings in comparison is worth it.

Ah so basing it all around. Bunch if hypotheticals hardly the greatest argument is it???

The reality is RVP almost single handedly at times got you that title, his goals were the decisive factor and nobody in any fit state would argue that Hernandez, Welbeck or Kagawa could have produced to the extent he did both in terms of goals and performances.

Old Bacon Face was not silly he saw what what was required and went out Nd got the one thing that could wrestle the title away...

I think it is dillusional to think without RVP you would have won the title that season, the cracks were already appearing in the other areas and only his goals saved you...

Can't argue with that. Kagawa on his own wouldn't have had the same effect, Kagawa + a world class CM and maybe I'd be inclined to agree.

Like you say Sir Alex simply saw RVP was available, knew he'd get goals out of him and bought him just to win the league that season. He wasn't planning too far ahead with that one but RVP is still good for another season or 2.

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

Briefly scanning through the thread, I don't see any comments regarding the news about Macheda, Cardiff have signed United striker Macheda on a three-year deal. Great signing for City, can't wait to see how he does!

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

Briefly scanning through the thread' date=' I don't see any comments regarding the news about Macheda, Cardiff have signed United striker Macheda on a three-year deal. Great signing for City, [b']can't wait to see how he does![/b]

Poorly.

Well that was an easy one.

In all seriousness Macheda would have never cut it in the PL and may even struggle in the Championship.

He was never going to get a sniff at United we've got much better players in both the squad and youth team coming through.

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Re: Official Red Devils Thread

Poorly.

Well that was an easy one.

In all seriousness Macheda would have never cut it in the PL and may even struggle in the Championship.

He was never going to get a sniff at United we've got much better players in both the squad and youth team coming through.

I was hoping to see a Adam le Fondre type of mould, obviously not :D

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