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The Weakness of 433 wing???


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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

just playing in friendly

1. 442 normal mentality vs 433 wing normal 3-0

but 433wing win more possesion and attacking chances, so i just go lucky to win, seems 442 is not 433wing best counter formation

2. 433 wing normal vs 442diamond defensive 1-3

442diamond win more possesion and chances

3. 433wing normal vs 442diamond normal 2-1

442diamond lose possesion but have more chances

recently i found have more possesion is more important than have more chances, especially when u counter attacking mentality with your defensive mentality, u always find a goal to win though with less chances than ur opponent

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing??? I used 4-3-3 wingers the other day and got beaten 3-0 with: 3-4-2-1 Tackling: Normal Mentality: Attacking Passing: Mixed Attacking: Mixed Tempo: Normal Pressing

Re: The Weakness of 433 wing??? It's the most frequent runs they'll make, so basically if you attack using only one wing, I'd definitely give the player in question an arrow in the direction you wan

Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

just playing in friendly

1. 442 normal mentality vs 433 wing normal 3-0

but 433wing win more possesion and attacking chances' date=' so i just go lucky to win, seems 442 is not 433wing best counter formation

2. 433 wing normal vs 442diamond defensive 1-3

442diamond win more possesion and chances

3. 433wing normal vs 442diamond normal 2-1

442diamond lose possesion but have more chances

recently i found have more possesion is more important than have more chances, especially when u counter attacking mentality with your defensive mentality, u always find a goal to win though with less chances than ur opponent[/quote']

I have a question, the 4-3-3wings teams were unmanaged or managed?

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

Here we are lads , the results :

Some notes :

1)In position 5-6 i use back-up players due to rotation since fitness was low on starters. Keep in mind Alderweireld 89 rating Rojo 88 !!

2)As playmaker use the DMC always .

3) @ Min 60 i swap tempo to Normal . || The other manager didn't change anything on team instructions.

4) The 1 goal i conceded were a free-kick :mad: .

Z60E7ZL.jpg?1

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

I have a question' date=' the 4-3-3wings [u']teams were[/u] unmanaged or managed?

433wing managed, with normal mentality, down both flanks & mixed n normal

i notice 433wing with normal mentality is the strongest,

as if ur opponet play 433wing with attacking mentality, u can counter him with 451def, 442 or 442diamond defensive mentality, u may have less chances, but u control more possesion & corner, and if the engine isnt exploded and ur goalkeeper doesnt screw up, for somehow ur team always find a chance to win by 1 or 2 goals

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

Here we are lads ' date=' the results :

Some notes :

1)In position 5-6 i use back-up players due to rotation since fitness was low on starters. Keep in mind Alderweireld 89 rating Rojo 88 !!

2)As playmaker use the DMC always .

3) @ Min 60 i swap [u']tempo to Normal[/u] . || The other manager didn't change anything on team instructions.

4) The 1 goal i conceded were a free-kick :mad: .

Z60E7ZL.jpg?1

cool, im gonna try that in friendly this saturday,

thanks for the input

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

cool' date=' im gonna try that in friendly this saturday,

thanks for the input[/quote']

Will wait your feedback mate.

P.s. try use the correct players in each position dont mind the rating too much. (double check my squad on match day to understand what i mean. )

433wing managed' date=' with normal mentality, down both flanks & mixed n normal

i notice 433wing with [b']normal[/b] mentality is the strongest,

as if ur opponet play 433wing with attacking mentality, u can counter him with 451def, 442 or 442diamond defensive mentality, u may have less chances, but u control more possesion & corner, and if the engine isnt exploded and ur goalkeeper doesnt screw up, for somehow ur team always find a chance to win by 1 or 2 goals

Thanks :)

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

451 didnt work well against 433wing normal mentality,

i lost the possesion, have less chances, lose the match in away

i will try 541 this tuesday,

to defeat 433wing with attacking mentality in away,

just use 451def with defensive mentality, counter attack, tight marking,

i tried it 3 times in these 2 weeks already, and always got more possesion, have less chances, but got managed to win 1-2 goals, today i even got win 4-0 with only 5 chances,

u can also use 352 defensive mentality against 433wing attacking mentality, but in your home game, not away

433wing is tied against 352, whatever formation playing home with right instructions will control more possesion,

as i say before, recently i got win with more possesion, but have less chances, its okay, i win the game

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

Currently with 5-4-1 i post below in a custom game world

i have ->

Home : 5 wins 0 draws 0 defeats 15 - 4 Goals

Away : 3 wins 2 draws 1 defeats 10 - 9 Goals

Note : All wins are with 5-4-1 , the two draws are with 4-4-2/4-4-2diamond, 3-5-2 , the one defeat is with 4-3-3w , 3-4-1-2 .

P.S. Key to success are 1) to use your players in correct position and get 100% of them 2) Trying to use players with high morale instead of rating only .

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

Currently with 5-4-1 i post below in a custom game world

i have ->

Home : 5 wins 0 draws 0 defeats 15 - 4 Goals

Away : 3 wins 2 draws 1 defeats 10 - 9 Goals

Note : All wins are with 5-4-1 ' date=' the [b']two draws are with 4-4-2/4-4-2diamond, 3-5-2[/b] , the one defeat is with 4-3-3w , 3-4-1-2 .

P.S. Key to success are 1) to use your players in correct position and get 100% of them 2) Trying to use players with high morale instead of rating only .

wow, thats amazing,

u use the instructions and mentality like the picture u posted below?

my friends use 541 attacking, and i counter him with 352 defensive mentality and got win

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

Currently with 5-4-1 i post below in a custom game world

i have ->

Home : 5 wins 0 draws 0 defeats 15 - 4 Goals

Away : 3 wins 2 draws 1 defeats 10 - 9 Goals

Note : All wins are with 5-4-1 ' date=' the [b']two draws are with 4-4-2/4-4-2diamond, 3-5-2[/b] , the one defeat is with 4-3-3w , 3-4-1-2 .

P.S. Key to success are 1) to use your players in correct position and get 100% of them 2) Trying to use players with high morale instead of rating only .

Were all games against 4-4-3 wings? If so, these are really good news- it seems 5-4-1 counters 433w.

What about instructions?

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

433wing with attacking mentality solved! 451def with defensive mentality & right instructions will counter and defeat them

now the problem is : 433wing with normal mentality, n mixed & normal instructions in their home, they are very very strong,

i try it already with 451def, 451, 442, 442diamond, 352 and all failed,

sometimes i win against them, but its just because their goalkeeper screwed them up, i always lost the possesion against them

ill try with 541 this week,

and probabaly will try 4231 with defensive or very defensive mentality(i just see my friend with 433wing normal got defeat twice with 4231 defensive mentality)

i will give the feedback after that

as to defeat 433wing with normal mentality in their away is not so difficult, 442, 442diamond, 352 in right instructions could defeat them

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

433wing with attacking mentality solved! 451def with defensive mentality & right instructions will counter and defeat them

now the problem is : 433wing with normal mentality' date=' n mixed & normal instructions, they are very very strong,

i try it already with 451def, 451, 442, 442diamond, 352 and all failed,

sometimes i win against them, but its just because their goalkeeper screwed them up, i always lost the possesion against them

ill try with 541 this week,

and probabaly will try 4231 with defensive or very defensive mentality(i just see my friend with 433wing normal got defeat twice with 4231 defensive mentality)

i will give the feedback after that[/quote']

Good job!

Generally it seams attacking mentality is not a good choice for any formations.

Maybe exception is aggressive 4-2-3-1 with tight marking, pressing all over, direct passing, fast tempo and counter attack. There are some managers in my GW who use it and have good results. It's not my style though as I prefer to build attack more slowly playing possesion football.

I also will arrange some friendlies against 4-3-3 wing with random instructions and will give feedback.

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

Were all games against 4-4-3 wings? If so' date=' these are really good news- it seems 5-4-1 counters 433w.

What about instructions?[/quote']

About the instructions of 5-4-1 winning formation check previous post have a picture :)

Update : 4-3-3wingers HOME all normal -vs- my 4-2-3-1 AWAY Hard tackles/Attacking mentality/Direct Passing/Fast tempo/Press All Over/Counter Attack/Target Man (CF) with arrows on 7-11 into the box (diagonal) and on 10 forward.

I won 0-4 (CF had a HAT-TRICK) possession 56% for me had 9 shoots 8 on target (4 were goals) and 9 corners. the other team had 44% possession 14 shoots 5 on target with 3 corners.

Similar rating teams 88-89 . (i do rotation here was a cup match) .

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

About the instructions of 5-4-1 winning formation check previous post have a picture :)

Update : 4-3-3wingers HOME all normal -vs- my 4-2-3-1 AWAY Hard tackles/Attacking mentality/Direct Passing/Fast tempo/Press All Over/Counter Attack/Target Man (CF) with arrows on 7-11 into the box (diagonal) and on 10 forward.

I won 0-4 (CF had a HAT-TRICK) possession 56% for me had 9 shoots 8 on target (4 were goals) and 9 corners. the other team had 44% possession 14 shoots 5 on target with 3 corners.

Similar rating teams 88-89 . (i do rotation here was a cup match) .

wow, thats really a good news

my friend last time beat 433wing normal with his 4231 defensive mentality, now i will give 4231 attacking a try,

thanks for the update mate!

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

About the instructions of 5-4-1 winning formation check previous post have a picture :)

Update : 4-3-3wingers HOME all normal -vs- my 4-2-3-1 AWAY Hard tackles/Attacking mentality/Direct Passing/Fast tempo/Press All Over/Counter Attack/Target Man (CF) with arrows on 7-11 into the box (diagonal) and on 10 forward.

I won 0-4 (CF had a HAT-TRICK) possession 56% for me had 9 shoots 8 on target (4 were goals) and 9 corners. the other team had 44% possession 14 shoots 5 on target with 3 corners.

Similar rating teams 88-89 . (i do rotation here was a cup match) .

wow' date=' thats really a good news

my friend last time beat 433wing normal with his 4231 defensive mentality, now i will give 4231 attacking a try,

thanks for the update mate![/quote']

So it seems 4-2-3-1 is worth further testing, both attacking and defensive mentality :)

This attacking mentality is really interesting- direct, fast play with constant pressure and attack. I've also noticed it gives good results in my GW to several managers.

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

So it seems 4-2-3-1 is worth further testing' date=' both attacking and defensive mentality :)

This attacking mentality is really interesting- direct, fast play with constant pressure and attack. I've also noticed it gives good results in my GW to several managers.[/quote']

Give it a try, when you are away team ;)

Attacking Mentality with fast play rule .

Direct passing .. depends on your team and the players you have .. might fail if you haven't players who can adapt this style of game

Constant pressure tempted to be for me the key factor that give me straight wins. Two past seasons i used to play with all over pressure, and notice that 1) i conceded lot of goals 2) my players fatigue were extremely high / add serious injuries here

Will wait your feedbacks guys , i really need a successful counter formation for 4-3-3w in coming weeks where i will play with the Barcelona and need this win badly, to challenge the opposite manager , he said he will crash me with high score ( i m currently 1st he is 3rd haha *Custom competitive GW*)

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

I played twice with my two teams against two different teams using formation 4-3-3 wingers. My teams played 4-1-3-2.

1. Porto- Aston Villa

Line ups:

Porto: De Gea, Cuadrado, Chiellini, Mascherano, Kompany, Rakitic, Modric, Busquets, Mandzukic, D.Costa, Nasri

Aston Villa: Valdes, Piszczek, Schmelzer, Bonucci, Godin, Ramsey, Moutinho, Tevez, Lewandowski, Jovetic, Mkhitaryan

Instructions:

Porto:

4-1-3-2: tackling hard, mentality normal, passing short, pressing all over(by mistake, wanted to use own half), men behind the ball, play maker, target man

Aston Villa:

4-3-3 wingers: taclng normal, mentality attacking, pressing all over, counter attack, tight marking, use playmaker

The result was 4-1 for Porto:

Stats:

Porto: possession 48%, total shots 11, on target 10, corners 5

Aston Villa: 52%, 5, 1, 8

2. Barcelona- Man City

Line ups:

Barcelona: De Gea, Cuadrado, Alaba, T.Silva, Benatia, Hazard, Fabregas, Lahm, G.Rossi, Rooney, Rakitic

Man City: Neuer, Piszczek, G.Boateng, Kompany Subotic, Sahin, Iniesta, Matuidi, Ibrahimovic, Cavani, Ribery

Instructions:

Barcelona: the same as Porto but pressing own half as I had planned

Man City: the same as Aston Villa

the score 0:3 for Man City

stats:

Barca: 40%, 5, 4, 3

Man City: 60%, 11, 9, 11

To sum up

There are two completely different results which is confusing.

Is this because of match engine or differences with squads? That's a question.

Porto had squad slightly better than Aston Villa with duo Modric-Busquets in the middle. The opponent had avarage attacking trio Mkhitaryan- Jovetic- Lewandowski against strong Porto defenders Cuadrado-Mascherano-Kompany-Chiellini.

In the second match Barcelona faced stronger side. The middle Fabregas- Lahm was also very strong such as in Porto but Man City had Iniesta in the middle and extremely strong attacking trio Cavani- Ribery- Ibrahimovic against barca defenders Cuadrado- T.Silva- Benatia- Alaba slightly weaker than Porto defence.

Probably strong City attack was the reason of such big difference in these two matches.

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

To sum up

There are two completely different results which is confusing.

Is this because of match engine or differences with squads? That's a question.

Porto had squad slightly better than Aston Villa with duo Modric-Busquets in the middle. The opponent had avarage attacking trio Mkhitaryan- Jovetic- Lewandowski against strong Porto defenders Cuadrado-Mascherano-Kompany-Chiellini.

In the second match Barcelona faced stronger side. The middle Fabregas- Lahm was also very strong such as in Porto but Man City had Iniesta in the middle and extremely strong attacking trio Cavani- Ribery- Ibrahimovic against barca defenders Cuadrado- T.Silva- Benatia- Alaba slightly weaker than Porto defence.

Probably strong City attack was the reason of such big difference in these two matches.

Found 3 issues :

First of all you have BENATIA as CB so don't mind why you lose . He suck balls in SM terms .

Second' date=' in the order you write the roster De Gea, Cuadrado, Alaba, T.Silva, Benatia, Hazard, Fabregas, Lahm, G.Rossi, Rooney, Rakitic

seems you use Hazard as DMC and AMC Fabregas - Lahm ?????? if yes is huge fail .

Third we said for counter 4-3-3w try 4-2-3-1 not 4-1-3-2 !!! :)

----------

I notice also from your feedback , that ticking "all over" give u more shoots / corners and dominate in this area of game .

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

Found 3 issues :

First of all you have BENATIA as CB so don't mind why you lose . He suck balls in SM terms .

Second' date=' in the order you write the roster De Gea, Cuadrado, Alaba, T.Silva, Benatia, Hazard, Fabregas, Lahm, G.Rossi, Rooney, Rakitic

seems you use Hazard as DMC and AMC Fabregas - Lahm ?????? if yes is huge fail .

Third we said for counter 4-3-3w try 4-2-3-1 not 4-1-3-2 !!! :)

----------

I notice also from your feedback , that ticking "all over" give u more shoots / corners and dominate in this area of game .

It was my plan to test 4-1-3-2 - it was played last thursday. And the next thursday I will play 4-2-3-1

1. I think there are only three factors which affect players' performance: rating, morale and fitness. And obvioulsly proper position. In friendlies probably only rating is important. Here could be Benatia but also Subotic for example. No difference.

2. Hazard played as AMC on the right, Fabregas AMC in the middle, Lahm as MC- everyone green ;)

I think Man City had simply too strong team expecially in attack and that's why they won. In the first match Villa's offence was too weak against Porto defenders.

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

It was my plan to test 4-1-3-2 - it was played last thursday. And the next thursday I will play 4-2-3-1

1. I think there are only three factors which affect players' performance: rating' date=' morale and fitness. In friendlies probably only rating is important. Here could be Benatia but also Subotic for example. No difference.

2. Hazard played as AMC on the right, Fabregas AMC in the middle, Lahm as MC- everyone green ;)

I think Man City had simply too strong team expecially in attack and that's why they won. In the first match Villa's offence was too weak against Porto defenders.[/quote']

Oh sorry then about the formations .

True about the offense / defense different but might the "all over pressure" is a key factor to 4-1-3-2 since you have plenty of players in front .

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

Oh sorry then about the formations .

True about the offense / defense different but might the "all over pressure" is a key factor to 4-1-3-2 since you have plenty of players in front .

Yes, this could make the difference but on the other hand men behind the ball doesn's seem to work well with all over pressure.

There is also possibility that one of these two matches was just this one match from ten when one team is better than another. Therefore we should play many matches using the same settings to judge tactics properly.

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

I played twice with my two teams against two different teams using formation 4-3-3 wingers. My teams played 4-1-3-2.

1. Porto- Aston Villa

Line ups:

Porto: De Gea' date=' Cuadrado, Chiellini, Mascherano, Kompany, Rakitic, Modric, Busquets, Mandzukic, D.Costa, Nasri

Aston Villa: Valdes, Piszczek, Schmelzer, Bonucci, Godin, Ramsey, Moutinho, Tevez, Lewandowski, Jovetic, Mkhitaryan

Instructions:

Porto:

4-1-3-2: tackling hard, mentality normal, passing short, pressing all over(by mistake, wanted to use own half), men behind the ball, play maker, target man

Aston Villa:

4-3-3 wingers: taclng normal, mentality attacking, pressing all over, counter attack, tight marking, use playmaker

The result was 4-1 for Porto:

Stats:

Porto: possession 48%, total shots 11, on target 10, corners 5

Aston Villa: 52%, 5, 1, 8

[b']2. Barcelona- Man City[/b]

Line ups:

Barcelona: De Gea, Cuadrado, Alaba, T.Silva, Benatia, Hazard, Fabregas, Lahm, G.Rossi, Rooney, Rakitic

Man City: Neuer, Piszczek, G.Boateng, Kompany Subotic, Sahin, Iniesta, Matuidi, Ibrahimovic, Cavani, Ribery

Instructions:

Barcelona: the same as Porto but pressing own half as I had planned

Man City: the same as Aston Villa

the score 0:3 for Man City

stats:

Barca: 40%, 5, 4, 3

Man City: 60%, 11, 9, 11

To sum up

There are two completely different results which is confusing.

Is this because of match engine or differences with squads? That's a question.

Porto had squad slightly better than Aston Villa with duo Modric-Busquets in the middle. The opponent had avarage attacking trio Mkhitaryan- Jovetic- Lewandowski against strong Porto defenders Cuadrado-Mascherano-Kompany-Chiellini.

In the second match Barcelona faced stronger side. The middle Fabregas- Lahm was also very strong such as in Porto but Man City had Iniesta in the middle and extremely strong attacking trio Cavani- Ribery- Ibrahimovic against barca defenders Cuadrado- T.Silva- Benatia- Alaba slightly weaker than Porto defence.

Probably strong City attack was the reason of such big difference in these two matches.

here is my analyze :

1. 4132 is not good against 433wing, as you see, you lost your possesion in both match, my principle in SM is we cant assure we win every match with this counter formation, sometimes the goalkeeper got screwed up and sometimes the whole team play bad, but from my experienced, if you have more possesion, though have less chances, the winning probability is higher. u can try one more time with 4132, if ur team lost the possesion again, then its proven that 4132 isnt good for counter 433wing

2. pressing all over make the difference i think. as u attacking more, but i didnt use this so much, as my stamina is decreasing more with all over, i normally use own half, but the good news is we know that pressing all over could make the difference, as my assume that 4132 will lose against 433wing if you play pressing own half

3. i dont think player ratings make the difference, sometimes 83rated player could defeat 94 rated player, and the possition is not that complex, soccerwiki attributes are useless, SM match engine is not that smart, i think the key to win more is in formation and instructions, also playing home and away is very different, sometimes the counter formation is also different in home and in away i notice

tonight i will face 433wing attacking in cup, i will use 451def, but if i losing the match in half match, i will switch to 4231 defensive, i will give the feedback soon tommorow

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

tonight i will face 433wing attacking in cup' date=' i will use 451def, but if i losing the match in half match, i will switch to 4231 defensive, i will give the feedback soon tommorow[/quote']

Try my 5-4-1 and if losing switch to 4-2-3-1 attacking (when u losing u dont need to stay back)

Yes' date=' this could make the difference but on the other hand men behind the ball doesn's seem to work well with all over pressure.

There is also possibility that one of these two matches was just this one match from ten when one team is better than another. Therefore we should play many matches using the same settings to judge tactics properly.[/quote']

"behind the ball doesn's seem to work well with all over pressure."

Works perfect only in defensive systems , with pressure own half / own area is the key to hold the backs and make your players priority to watch out to not lose ball .

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Re: The Weakness of 433 wing???

here is my analyze :

1. 4132 is not good against 433wing' date=' as you see, you lost your possesion in both match, my principle in SM is we cant assure we win every match with this counter formation, sometimes the goalkeeper got screwed up and sometimes the whole team play bad, but from my experienced, if you have more possesion, though have less chances, the winning probability is higher. u can try one more time with 4132, if ur team lost the possesion again, then its proven that 4132 isnt good for counter 433wing

2. pressing all over make the difference i think. as u attacking more, but i didnt use this so much, as my stamina is decreasing more with all over, i normally use own half, but the good news is we know that pressing all over could make the difference, as my assume that 4132 will lose against 433wing if you play pressing own half

3. i dont think player ratings make the difference, sometimes 83rated player could defeat 94 rated player, and the possition is not that complex, soccerwiki attributes are useless, SM match engine is not that smart, i think the key to win more is in formation and instructions.

tonight i will face 433wing attacking in cup, i will use 451def, but if i losing the match in half match, i will switch to 4231 defensive, i will give the feedback soon tommorow[/quote']

Yes, you are right 4-1-3-2 is offensive formation. I wanted to check it with good offensive midfielders who were suppose to maintain possesion and engage to attack with more players. Wanted to find out whether it works against opposition playing attacking mentality and counter attack. It didn't.

SM is simple game and only rating, mentality and fitness are important in matches plus RB should play as RB, not as DC or RM where he is marked yellow :)

Obviously it doesn't matter when player is fast and has good dribbling in reality. Rating is the sum of his attributes and affects the game.

Waiting for feedback and will write about my teams' results.

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