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I like running up my debt >:-)

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SM thinks that it is funny to push me further and further into debt, because I have all the best players in my team and the wages are too costly.

 

But I have hoarded all the players that I want now...and SM cannot force me to sell players to balance the books. So I am going to happily sink further and further in the red. WHAT IS SM GOING TO DO ABOUT IT!? HA HA

 

>:-)

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Well I think you already know that SM won't do anything.  Obviously you won't be able to sign any new players once you are in debt but, as you say, your Chairman isn't going to force you to sell players either like he would in real life.  Just the same as, in SM, you don't get sacked for a poor performance as you might in real life.  Hell, you can even just show up for work one day in 30 and you don't even get disciplined!!

 

However, isn't your post rather self-defeating?

 

This is a simulated management game and, to my mind, there are 3 objectives or challenges to anyone who chooses to participate..

 

1.  To build and develop your team in terms of rating and value.

2.  To win trophies or promotion.

3.  To achieve 1 & 2 within the constraints of the budget of the club you have chosen to manage.

 

If you are admitting that you are unable to achieve point 3 then surely that's an admission of failure, no? 

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Not when the rules are changed half way through, no.

I'd say it's more of a silent protest at the poor financial changes than a failure.

Fair comment. However, don't the rules get changed all the time in real life?

Bosman ruling, financial fair play rules, off-side rules, points for a win, transfer windows, etc, etc.,

I suppose how each person reacts depends on how up for a challenge they are.

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Fair comment. However, don't the rules get changed all the time in real life?

Bosman ruling, financial fair play rules, off-side rules, points for a win, transfer windows, etc, etc.,

I suppose how each person reacts depends on how up for a challenge they are.

Yes, rules change, but clubs are given notice before they come into effect, usually during the off season, so they have time to adjust.

At no point in football history did anyone immediately double wages during the middle of a season, and expect clubs to manage with no balancing addition to income. At least real clubs get the benefit of huge TV deals and better merchandising incomes.

It's very hard to "just deal with it", when a club you've built up and a team you've assembled over years suddenly doesn't work any more (partly because of some moronic positioning change to your players, who overnight now can't play 10 yards further down the pitch than they could the day before...) and you now lose millions per week.

When it negatively affects all but the biggest 5% of clubs in the game, you know it's a poorly thought out plan.

Actually, in my cynical mind, I think it was deliberately planned that way - you can reserve clubs in new game worlds, right? For money? And there's only a few big clubs per game world now that can support the biggest stars and survive paying the wages? Hmm...

But I can't believe SM would do that, what with their immaculate and caring customer service record.

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I am just pointing out that debt makes no difference once you have assembled the overpowered team that you want...and hoarded all the best players. You can just sit pretty.

 

The financial changes have done nothing but solidify the status quo. Taking myself as an example, I would only ever consider selling a player if I could 'wheel and deal' and use the proceeds to buy a player or two players that I considered better...or to be worth the initial sale. For this, I would need to be in the black (or atleast level) for it to be worth it. The changes (and wage bills) have now pushed me so far into the red that I now don't even consider selling any of my players...because the proceeds would only go so far as to clear my debt...and what would be the point in that!

 

The financial changes, which I can only imagine were introduced to encourage more trading and transfer activity, have actually produced the opposite effect. The strongest teams already have enough highly rated players to be suitably satisfied and with no obligation to clear their debts, they can just shut up shop and take the hit to their finances. Their squad strength is solidified.

 

I am not complaining though >:-)

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It's very hard to "just deal with it", when a club you've built up and a team you've assembled over years suddenly doesn't work any more (partly because of some moronic positioning change to your players, who overnight now can't play 10 yards further down the pitch than they could the day before...) 

 

...I disagree with you on this point.

 

What you are referring to it an inability to abuse the overpowered 3-5-2 formation. That's right. In relation to SM, the 3-5-2 formation should never be referred to without the word ABUSE or ABUSER accompanying it.

 

Too many little girls used...sorry, abused...the 3-5-2, week in, week out. Everyone was abusing it...so don't give me some BS about how you were 'unique' in how you deployed it. I put money on the fact that you used to deploy players out of their factually stated SM/Soccerwiki positions in the 3-5-2. with success. Now you cant.

 

It's your own silly fault if you abused a loophole and flaw in the game engine and it is even more laughable that you were moronic enough to build your team around this loophole...but lets not open this can of worms!

 

Needless to say, the game engine/formation changes were the most important and needed parts of the update.

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i like you points Brut, if the developers actually came on here for some feedback id suggest the following

 

Debt would have a meaning. Chairman dont like debt and therefore would request you sell players, possible fringe players or those deemed not good enough. They deem some players too good to go on loan or too big a prospect, so why not the opposite?

 

Also id like to see proper contracts implemented. Make it up to the manager to keep an eye on them and offer new ones, failure to do so would mean a player would be transfer listed when it expires. If you have 250+ players, youll have your work cut out keeping them up to date haha

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i like you points Brut, if the developers actually came on here for some feedback id suggest the following

 

Debt would have a meaning. Chairman dont like debt and therefore would request you sell players, possible fringe players or those deemed not good enough. They deem some players too good to go on loan or too big a prospect, so why not the opposite?

 

Also id like to see proper contracts implemented. Make it up to the manager to keep an eye on them and offer new ones, failure to do so would mean a player would be transfer listed when it expires. If you have 250+ players, youll have your work cut out keeping them up to date haha

 

Haha thanks. Although with regards to the finances, I personally don't have too many complaints...as I am one of the managers that I am referring to! Through a variety of deals I have a squad packed full of 1x92, 5x91, 10x90, 7x89 and a 6 players between 86-88 (under 24 years old). Many of these players rarely get a game!

 

As you can imagine, I engineered this before the update and whilst my finances were always slightly in the red...the changes have caused my wage bills to skyrocket and I am now -9.7 million, with the debt increasing fast! But why would I settle the debt? What would be the point? I am now left hoping that prize money and chairman investments will help pay my bills, because I certainly will not sell players to clear it if I can avoid doing so.

 

Having said this, I would be all for a forced transfer system when managers got in debt, providing that it was applied equally.

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...I disagree with you on this point.

 

What you are referring to it an inability to abuse the overpowered 3-5-2 formation. That's right. In relation to SM, the 3-5-2 formation should never be referred to without the word ABUSE or ABUSER accompanying it.

 

Too many little girls used...sorry, abused...the 3-5-2, week in, week out. Everyone was abusing it...so don't give me some BS about how you were 'unique' in how you deployed it. I put money on the fact that you used to deploy players out of their factually stated SM/Soccerwiki positions in the 3-5-2. with success. Now you cant.

 

It's your own silly fault if you abused a loophole and flaw in the game engine and it is even more laughable that you were moronic enough to build your team around this loophole...but lets not open this can of worms!

 

Needless to say, the game engine/formation changes were the most important and needed parts of the update.

Thank you for the unnecessary abuse and assumptions on management style.

I change my tactics depending on who I'm playing. I used the 352 when it was suitable, just as I use 433, 4231, 451, 3133, etc.

Did 352 work better than most in more situations? Yes. Did I personally abuse it? I'd like to think no, but I guess that would be down to the subjective opinion of the other managers in the GW's I play in.

With regards to the topic at hand, yes you can sit pretty with a top rated team going further into the red, but at some point in the future you are going to need to get new players. It may not be for a few years, but your players will age, and if you sell them too late the value probably won't be enough to clear the debt. Then what?

I'm not disagreeing with you, it's a flawed financial system and it doesn't do what it was intended to do, but ultimately if you can't afford the players you've got, it'll bite you at some point, or force you to sell before values drop too low with age.

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Well I think you already know that SM won't do anything.  Obviously you won't be able to sign any new players once you are in debt but, as you say, your Chairman isn't going to force you to sell players either like he would in real life.  Just the same as, in SM, you don't get sacked for a poor performance as you might in real life.  Hell, you can even just show up for work one day in 30 and you don't even get disciplined!!

 

However, isn't your post rather self-defeating?

 

This is a simulated management game and, to my mind, there are 3 objectives or challenges to anyone who chooses to participate..

 

1.  To build and develop your team in terms of rating and value.

2.  To win trophies or promotion.

3.  To achieve 1 & 2 within the constraints of the budget of the club you have chosen to manage.

 

If you are admitting that you are unable to achieve point 3 then surely that's an admission of failure, no? 

 

Is it really my failure that SM doesn't allow me to do anything for the finantial health of my club other than hoarding players?

 

In season 1 I grabbed probably the worst team in portuguese 2nd division and 18 seasons later the first 11 averages 96. The stadium remained with the same 8k seats most of the time until very recently it was pumped up to an amazing 13k seats. And I suppose to compete finantially with teams with 50k and 65k stadiums...

 

They turn a profit even without hoarding players. I'm losing 100M per season...

 

How's this my failure?

 

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Prize money is huge. When the changes coame in my 1 guilty pleasure non FOrum or custom team is a spurs AVG rating 96 in my first EC i ever joined. I before with prize money and the buy/sell of a few risers a year could stay afloat. With the new changes initially i had to sell Diego Costa and Bernat to keep my balance at +7M. but then i won the season and the CL and now my balance is like 100M and i am better off financially than i ever was.

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Prize money is huge. When the changes coame in my 1 guilty pleasure non FOrum or custom team is a spurs AVG rating 96 in my first EC i ever joined. I before with prize money and the buy/sell of a few risers a year could stay afloat. With the new changes initially i had to sell Diego Costa and Bernat to keep my balance at +7M. but then i won the season and the CL and now my balance is like 100M and i am better off financially than i ever was.

That's another thing. Coming in 2nd is almost as bad as coming in last.

 

Las 2 seasons I spent the whole time in 1st only to drop to 2nd on the last match...

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Is it really my failure that SM doesn't allow me to do anything for the finantial health of my club other than hoarding players?

 

In season 1 I grabbed probably the worst team in portuguese 2nd division and 18 seasons later the first 11 averages 96. The stadium remained with the same 8k seats most of the time until very recently it was pumped up to an amazing 13k seats. And I suppose to compete finantially with teams with 50k and 65k stadiums...

 

They turn a profit even without hoarding players. I'm losing 100M per season...

 

How's this my failure?

 

 

You judge for yourself mate.  It's not my job to give everyone their performance grades. 

 

If your first team averages 96 then I would hazard a guess that you could probably lose a couple and still have the best team in your league but I don't want to tell you (or anyone else) how to manage your club.  It's up to you.

 

I was just pointing out what I think are the main objectives/challenges of the game.  How you personally go about achieving them or, indeed, whether you even want to is your business.

 

If it's any consolation you are not the only one in that situation. 

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wait...

 

wait.

 

wait!

 

so a guy who spammed the entire forum for months whining about people abusing SM's tactical system that didn't work (and still doesn't work btw, one of my opponents plays two of CR, Ozil, Silva and Hazard wide in 3412 and has suffered no loss of form at all) is in fact a proud abuser of SM's financial system that doesn't work?

 

L
 

O

 

L

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Unfortunately, the new valuation system just made things worse.

Youngsters, who are usually the biggest risers, were the backbone of small teams that were trying to grow, based on good scouting.

Youngsters are now ridiculously overpriced.

And even weirder is that a player in Barça, Bayern or Real Madrid seems to be worth the same as in very small teams.

I honestly don't get it... :huh:  

 

EDIT: and how come wages vary from club to club?

For instance, I signed Kane for my Braga and his salary almost doubled.

To make things even worse, it was in this budget restriction based setup, which was significantly messed up by these changes.  

 

EDIT 2: the system is so bogus now, that you actually have the opposite of what I mentioned above too.

I bought 78 rated Renato Sanches - he was worth 2M.

He rose to 82 - and still 18 yo - and now he's worth a whopping 2.8M.  :P

Plus, you have players with more positions, the same/inferior age, compared to other players.

Yet the formers are worth less than the latters in SM.  B)

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wait...

 

wait.

 

wait!

 

so a guy who spammed the entire forum for months whining about people abusing SM's tactical system that didn't work (and still doesn't work btw, one of my opponents plays two of CR, Ozil, Silva and Hazard wide in 3412 and has suffered no loss of form at all) is in fact a proud abuser of SM's financial system that doesn't work?

 

L

 

O

 

L

 

Haha dude get over it.

 

Hating ages you.

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Prize money is huge. When the changes coame in my 1 guilty pleasure non FOrum or custom team is a spurs AVG rating 96 in my first EC i ever joined. I before with prize money and the buy/sell of a few risers a year could stay afloat. With the new changes initially i had to sell Diego Costa and Bernat to keep my balance at +7M. but then i won the season and the CL and now my balance is like 100M and i am better off financially than i ever was.

Sorry, it isn't 'that' huge. I just won the league with one of my sides, and there is no way I can go on a 'transfer splurge' because I know, thanks to the naff new finance system I'll be in debt within a few weeks of the new season. I rarely ever buy players at all any more, as in order to do so I would have to sell great players in order to buy in average ones simply to break even. 

 

This is the model of small, lower tier teams, but it isn't an accurate model for top flight, or even big second tier sides in the real world. In the EPL for example, no-one should ever get into the red any more because the TV companies are literally hosing money on them. As such the new finance system is completely unrealistic.   .

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