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Re: Stadium Building

A while ago when I was like 10 I did a Division 4 challenge with Grimsby. i ditched it when it got hard in Div 3 xD. Anyway another gut took em over when I went back for my Grimsby and get them to Div 2. I left SM after a while and then came back and checked my beloved Grimsby. They wree unmanaged in Div 2 and had been raided. Now I have 100 mil to spend but I'm worried about the stadium size of Blundell Park which is a mere 10'000. I'm hoping to get promoted this season and compete in Division 1 with my old rival who manages Bradford and is enjoying life in Div 1. His stadium size is 25k and I can't help but feel I'm going to create a MASSIVE debt.

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Re: Stadium Building Hi all, Well I must say I'm a little depressed after reading this thread! Joined SM because I wanted to take a small club to geatness, not do the usual 'keep a great club great'

Re: Stadium Building

Wouldn't work :o The average would always be increasing and the system would cause massively oversized stadia.

Not so. Sure, it would result in increases over time, but the only way the biggest stadiums would get an increase is if the average stadium size in the league was less than 15% below yours. That's why I'm advocating an average stadium size +X% system that is based on success.

League average +40% is a little high as the ceiling, but league average +5%,+10%,+15% would definately be workable as it would mean a handful of clubs would see benefit. For example, after season 3, the clubs that are most successful and therefore can expand to average+15% (at a cost of say £15m) are Man Utd, Spurs and Ipswich. The league average is 32,000.

Would Man Utd expand? No, because average +15% is lower than their current stadium size. Would Spurs expand? No, as WHL is 38K and the league average +15% would not be an increase. Would Ipswich expand? Sure, a jump to 37,000 is definately worth it.

Over time, the league average would increase and eventually it would make sense for Spurs, and eventually Man Utd to upgrade - but not every season as the returns would be diminishing. You certainly wouldn't see a proliferation of 'Super Stadia' yet small clubs would be able to start competing after a few seasons of sustained success.

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Re: Stadium Building

Not so. Sure' date=' it would result in increases over time, but the only way the biggest stadiums would get an increase is if the average stadium size in the league was less than 15% below yours. That's why I'm advocating an average stadium size +X% system that is based on success.

League average +40% is a little high as the ceiling, but league average +5%,+10%,+15% would definately be workable as it would mean a handful of clubs would see benefit. For example, after season 3, the clubs that are most successful and therefore can expand to average+15% (at a cost of say £15m) are Man Utd, Spurs and Ipswich. The league average is 32,000.

Would Man Utd expand? No, because average +15% is lower than their current stadium size. Would Spurs expand? No, as WHL is 38K and the league average +15% would not be an increase. Would Ipswich expand? Sure, a jump to 37,000 is definately worth it.

Over time, the league average would increase and eventually it would make sense for Spurs, and eventually Man Utd to upgrade - but not every season as the returns would be diminishing. You certainly wouldn't see a proliferation of 'Super Stadia' yet small clubs would be able to start competing after a few seasons of sustained success.[/quote']

I disagree and might play the maths student card :P

If you raise a stadium to the league average + any percentage then the league average will increase. Thus next time a new stadium upgrade has to happen it will be bigger than the previous one. Continue this for a few seasons with the exponential growth of the league average and soon all stadia will be oversized. The only way to combat this would be to introduce negative stadium increases which isn't realistic at all.

Overall, I'd say keep the system as it is but be more lenient with it :o

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Re: Stadium Building

I'll see your maths student card and play the research director card in return ;)

The growth is certain, yes, but the scale would be contingent on success - which would be the limiting factor. If (as is likely) the most successful teams in the top divisions are initially the established teams with bigger stadia and pockets then there would be no growth at all from these teams in the short term. It would take an almost constant rotation of small clubs having sustained success in order for the league average to grow substantially over time. Even if it did grow over a sustained amount of seasons, in order for the biggest clubs to grow it would mean the league average rising to 85% of their capactity - over 60k in something like the EPL, which would take ages under this system.

To make it clear, I'm not proposing that all clubs are able to increase. Just the top 6 in each division based on win average - and only then if they are willing to spend a subtantial portion of their transfer budget on stadium improvement.

You'd probably need to model it carefully to check every eventuality but I'm fairly certain that this system would work extremely well over a 30-40 season period but might well start to have some strange effects after that. The best way to limit these things would be to have a maximum number of increases (no more than 1 every 3 seasons) or make it cost prohibitive to make small incremenal increases every season.

Just throwing it out there as a possible solution. I doubt it would get implemented as it's a little complex in it's mechanic, but it ticks most of the boxes imo.

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Re: Stadium Building

I have a blackpool team that has jut got promoted into division 1 and was given a stadium increase of 6,500 seats.

Now, I know you get an increase for getting promoted if you have a smaller club, but will I continue to get increases in stadium size if I am doing well in division 1 or is that it because I cannot get promoted anymore

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Re: Stadium Building

I have a blackpool team that has jut got promoted into division 1 and was given a stadium increase of 6' date='500 seats.

Now, I know you get an increase for getting promoted if you have a smaller club, but will I continue to get increases in stadium size if I am doing well in division 1 or is that it because I cannot get promoted anymore[/quote']

My Bury team also get into div 1 last week, and my stadium got increase by 11,000, and its now 23,832 :)

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Re: Stadium Building

I have a blackpool team that has jut got promoted into division 1 and was given a stadium increase of 6' date='500 seats.

Now, I know you get an increase for getting promoted if you have a smaller club, but will I continue to get increases in stadium size if I am doing well in division 1 or is that it because I cannot get promoted anymore[/quote']

You'll still get increases, but usually not by much. My Bradford started their 3rd season in Division 1 today and got an increase of 210.

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Re: Stadium Building

To make money more worthwhile (a constant problem) you should be able to pay for stadium increases out of your balance at hefty prices. people will spend money to improve their stadium for 3 possible reasons.

1. People will see it as another target, to max out their capacity

2. An investment. Eventual profit will be made long term from gate receipts

3. SM could probably develop this as an idea to attract players who wont normally join your club (im in a custom game world where you cant buy anyone over 85 rating and we have started with poor team. tried to sign kagawa and he would not join my team because it aint good enough yet). maybe stadium capacity coul be an incentive and maybe even to the extreme big players like messi, ronaldo wont join teams with a smaller stadium than barce/real!! this will in turn encourage big teams like arsenal, chelsea sell players they wouldnt normally allow to go for money in order to raise money for stadium increases.

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Re: Stadium Building

I'm hoping to get an extension in my stadium because it's currently got 30' date='009 and that isn't good for a top division side.[/quote']
I want to begin with West Ham but the stadium is only 35000. Is that enough if I want to be a top club?
Yeah thats a pretty decent size. Obviosly your big champions league clubs have bigger stadiums' date=' but if you do well then your chairman might increase it.[/quote']

I have never seen a stadium which already has a capacity of around 27,000 (give or take) get an increase in capacity and certainly no stadium with a capacity over 30,000. Stadia get an increase if their capacity is significantly below the average capacity/attendance of the division they are competing in. As 30,000 is already close to the average attendance in any division in any gameworld, the chances of a capacity increase are remote (if not nil). It may be different if you are competing in a custom gameworld with perhaps 10 of the highest average attendance clubs in your division, but not in any standard gameworld division

So how long does it take to increase the stadium size? my ground is currently at a capacity of 5' date='057 and has nearly been full the past few games. but as you can imagine its very difficult to make ends meet.[/quote']

Any stadium capacity increase will only be applied at the end of the seson among the same principles mentioned above. If you are in a division (or get promoted to a division) where the average attendance is significantly above yours, then you will get an increase in capacity. If on the other hand, the average attendance in your division is around 7k, you're unlikely to get a stadium capacity increase irrespcetive of your stadium being full.

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Re: Stadium Building

Any stadium capacity increase will only be applied at the end of the seson among the same principles mentioned above. If you are in a division (or get promoted to a division) where the average attendance is significantly above yours' date=' then you will get an increase in capacity. If on the other hand, the average attendance in your division is around 7k, you're unlikely to get a stadium capacity increase irrespcetive of your stadium being full.[/quote']

I'd say the average capacity is around 12 to 15,000, I'm fairly new to this league so i don't expect it to happen straight away. will just have to wait and see what happens at the end of the season.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Re: Stadium Building

Hmmm, I'm in an English Championship which is just going into it's 7th season.

Now, my Grimsby side got successive promotions to the 1st Division and on the first season in there got a nice bump from around 14k to 21k capacity and then again a bump from 21k to 22.7k last season.

This season, after winning my 2nd successive 1st Division title I recieved no bump in capacity and my gut feeling is that I'll never get another one under the current rules. The reason for that is because the 'bigger' teams are being overtaken in the division by smaller clubs such as Darlington, Ipswich, Crewe, Bradford - with some large capacities (Liverpool, Newcastle) relegated to Div 2. The net effect being that average attendances are getting smaller in Div1...

Actually, I wonder if it would even be possible in saaaay 3 or 4 seasons time that it would be more likely to get a stadium increase in Div2 if most of the teams in there are relegated Div 1 teams! Unliklely but still a crazy situation.

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Re: Stadium Building

Hmmm' date=' I'm in an English Championship which is just going into it's 7th season.

Now, my Grimsby side got successive promotions to the 1st Division and on the first season in there got a nice bump from around 14k to 21k capacity and then again a bump from 21k to 22.7k last season.

This season, after winning my 2nd successive 1st Division title I recieved no bump in capacity and my gut feeling is that I'll never get another one under the current rules. The reason for that is because the 'bigger' teams are being overtaken in the division by smaller clubs such as Darlington, Ipswich, Crewe, Bradford - with some large capacities (Liverpool, Newcastle) relegated to Div 2. The net effect being that average attendances are getting smaller in Div1...

Actually, I wonder if it would even be possible in saaaay 3 or 4 seasons time that it would be more likely to get a stadium increase in Div2 if most of the teams in there are relegated Div 1 teams! Unliklely but still a crazy situation.[/quote']

Sounds possible actually. And yeah that would be a bit mad.

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Re: Stadium Building

To make money more worthwhile (a constant problem) you should be able to pay for stadium increases out of your balance at hefty prices. people will spend money to improve their stadium for 3 possible reasons.

1. People will see it as another target' date=' to max out their capacity

2. An investment. Eventual profit will be made long term from gate receipts

3. SM could probably develop this as an idea to attract players who wont normally join your club (im in a custom game world where you cant buy anyone over 85 rating and we have started with poor team. tried to sign kagawa and he would not join my team because it aint good enough yet). maybe stadium capacity coul be an incentive and maybe even to the extreme big players like messi, ronaldo wont join teams with a smaller stadium than barce/real!! this will in turn encourage big teams like arsenal, chelsea sell players they wouldnt normally allow to go for money in order to raise money for stadium increases.[/quote']

A very good idea!

send it in as a ticket!

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Re: Stadium Building

I'm currently managing Fulham (capacity 26,600) and even though last season I got them into the SMFA Champions Cup (by finishing third in the league) the chairman still did not increase the capacity of the stadium? I have just qualified from the group stage of this tournament too. Do you think if I have another great season and qualify for this tournament again the chairman will increase? I am now signing players with 90+ ratings and need to fund wages/transfers.

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Re: Stadium Building

I've been managing Monaco for a while in WC 4203. Started in Div.3 with their tiny 18,000 seat stadium. Brought them up as follows:

Season 2: Promotion to Div.2

Season 3: Promotion to Div.1, World Champ Shield winner

Season 4: Div.1 Winner

Season 5: Div.1 Runner-up, SMFA Champions Cup Runner-up

Season 6: Currently top of the table and in semis of both cups.

After all this, my stadium has only had one increase to 32,000 (average attendance 30,000) meaning I am still all the way at the bottom of the table in terms of stadium size and attendance. Far behind my main rival Barcelona and his 98,000 seat stadium...

I realise there's a risk that stadium increases will devalue money further. On the other hand, I think it would stop the whole risers speculation game getting over the top, as it would give managers a more stable income. I constantly have to buy-to-sell players in order to cope with my negative weekly balance.

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Re: Stadium Building

New to the game but recall reading somewhere that, amongst other things, attendances are related in some way to actual club attendances. Some clubs: Monaco, Grimsby, Accrington Stanley - to name a few, probably have absolute limits to attendance growth. Gretna is another that springs to mind. Could this be a factor?

At present the stadium building element of teh game smacks of tokenism.

My team West Ham, I guess, is stuck with its 35k capacity, reading the comments on this thread. Lots of work for the academy.

On a releted point - if say a Mexican club with a large capacity is successful will their gates and receipts rise to fill the ground if the team rises through the leagues.

MH.

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Re: Stadium Building

My Shorpe team who look likely to finish second again in the to pleague to Man UTD have a staduim size of 23,398 which has risen (sometiems only by 2k at a time) over the past 6 or so seasons so a 30k capacity isnt to be sniffed at though I feel your pain! Top league teams should average out to at least 40k to regain some sort of even footing with finances.

I did the math and the average stadium size for my top division is 38,614 with average attendance set at 34,088. I certainly hope for an increase at the end of this season to help things along a bit!

I find it unfair that Man UTD who are top only have an average of 98 empty seats per season whereas I second and won a cup have 2,038 empty seats per year!

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Re: Stadium Building

As a manager of weak side like Burnley, i do agreed about stadium concerns. In first season stadium capacity 22,546 goes to 25,327 in third season. While all big club get big money, my team became desperate in maintaining wage! As u can see my achievement in my sign, i hope u would upgraded the stadium worth oh their achievement! With 4 games to go, as second placed team, i hope u should consider all manager concern!;)

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