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Guest melbguy1

Del Piero vs Trezequet

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Re: Del Piero vs Trezequet

You can't compare players when they are different positions as it simply doesn't work mate. I was not saying "if you look at the last 2 seasons between Trez and Del",i was saying between Ibrah and Del. We can cancel Juve's last season remember so that shouldn't come into it at all when discussing their rating,and the season before Ibrahimovic was at Juve and he played rubbish. I know Del played on the left sometimes and another position or 2 but he's a F on the game and thats where he has played most this season like the majority of others.And it's been better than Ibrahimovic again,so he can't be that much lower. He could play better than Trezeguet for 20 seasons in a row and it wouldn't matter,Trezeguet could still have a higher rating as he does different things.Your whole argument or point your making has no basis because of this,sorry.

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Guest melbguy1

Re: Del Piero vs Trezequet

Like I said jacob I agree with you with the CF v F issue.

As for DP v Ibra you and I both know what happened at Juve back then, and we could write a 5 page essay with quotes from famous sport writers as to why DP is should be rated closer to Ibra, but SM is just going to say, Inter won scudetto last year, and are on top this year, Inter have had CL last year and this year and he plays more for his country..... I mean it's not real life in all cases, it's SM's 'rating system'.

Also, I not too sure if SM meant that Juve's last seasons ratings were frozen, I'm sure if Juve were bottom mid-season that their players would have gotten a ratings hit. I think they were just not going to add the 'Serie B' thing to their script for Juve which allowed them to maintain their ratings in a lower league. Which in turn I don't think SM are counting Juve's season 3 years ago into their ratings.

But yes, I agree with the position thing, but (lol.. lots of buts) does anyone know of any examples of where a secondary striker has scored more then his CF in both of the last 2 years and yet still be rated lower then him, international/CL stats must be similar.

It's one or the other imo, either Trez is overrated or DP is underrated, but it cannot currently stand at where it lies, that's with watching Juve games as well as stats.

That's unless your saying that Trez has been more effective in his role as a CF then what DP has been as a F, which then I'm gonna have to outright disagree.

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Re: Del Piero vs Trezequet

lol,there is far too many buts in all of it mate,because they clearly don't know how to judge players and need to bring other factors into it. Your spot on in that Del's underrated and looking at his last couple of years goals wise to Trezeguet's he should be closer or level maybe. It's just they are different positions so nobody can really say who's the best between them,and thats what they say,or atleast people in here do. So we can't argue with that. If you show them similar players though were one is obviously underrated,they simply have to atleast consider it imo. Saying they are not in the CL when it's not their fault and they have already well proved themselves at that level is not on, because the likes of Del Piero have proved themselves on every level. For seasons aswell,not one or two. It's the biggest joke about the game,players not getting ratings because they are not in certain comps or played enough,when in the comps they are in they look better than players rated higher or the same.It makes the ratings and the so-called specialists look stupid sometimes. Villarreal are the same now imo,the same goals conceded as Barca and 10 points above, yet they have no 90 or 90+ rated CB's,but thats another story.

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Guest melbguy1

Re: Del Piero vs Trezequet

thanks jacob, as usual (to me anyway) you make sense, however if the response to my Ticket is that Trez is a CF and DP is F I will hold you personally accountable .. lol

I sent another one using the ticket system rather then the email address and got an instant reponse saying something like 'thanks for the info will be forwarded to our team of researchers' just as it got deleted from 'my tickets'. Not sure if this is normal as it's my first ever ticket. Will they give me a response either way? will it be via email? or will a new ticket response just appear even though it has been deleted? And the age old question, how long should I wait? And I guess, do they only respond to GM's?

Call me weird or whatever but I'm just really interested to hear what they say.

I sent an email yesterday about Salihamidzic's position, how it shouldn't be a RM/RB should be more of a W/RB or if they feeling generous even a M/RB. His position got changed today to a RM/LM, so maybe they do read the emails, then again it could have been someone elses ticket.

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Re: Del Piero vs Trezequet

Going by what others have said, i think you have had your response mate and you will know how they feel about it if his rating changes. I have only ever sent an email about ratings and got no response,so that seems a waste of time,as others have said the same too. With your ticket getting closed though you will have to make a new one if you want to know their reasons i think. I have made a few tickets but not for ratings and when they close it without resolving whatever it is about,i just make another. With them saying it will be sent to the researchers you might be best waiting a couple of days to get back in touch about it,although they could probably do it now if they wanted. Oh,and if they only respond to GM's they want shooting.

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Guest melbguy1

Re: Del Piero vs Trezequet

well after almost 2 weeks and 2 very friendly reminders I have submitted a new ticket... let's see how it goes this time...

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Guest melbguy1

Re: Del Piero vs Trezequet

Well got a response that wasn't automated:

Hi Melbguy,

This has been passed on to the researchers who will consider an increase for Del Piero or a decrease for Trezeguet the next time Italy is reviewed.

Regards

****

sigh:( I should have listened to tebthereb and not get too excited about the response :rolleyes:

The saga is not over though ;) As imo this is a pretty bad response.

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Guest melbguy1

Re: Del Piero vs Trezequet

ok, I concede defeat, not due to not having a case but to the poor/non ticket responses. Just to close this loop I'm posting the correspondence.

=================================

Hi,

Just querying over Del Piero's rating of 93 while his teammate has a 94.

Below are stats between the 2 all the way back to the World Cup.

2006 World Cup

TZ 3 games - 2 as sub

DP 5 games - 4 as sub

Serie B 06/07

TZ 15 Goals

DP 20 Goals (Top Scorer in league)

UEFA qualification 07/08

TZ 3 games - 1 as sub

DP 5 games - 2 as sub

Serie A 07/08

TZ 19(1) 5 assists 34 games (1 sub) 3030 mins (Currently joint 1st)

DP 18(2) 6 assists 34 games (5 sub) 2712 mins (Currently 2nd)

Coppa Italia 07/08

TZ 0 goals

DP 3 goals

DP had more WC appearances

DP had more goals last season

DP has more appearances for his nation

DP has more assists

DP has more goals this season

Trez has more minutes

I'm been playing the game for a while now and am a little confused (unless I'm missing a stat or have gotten some of them wrong).

SM Support said: 2008-05-23 10:17:13 BST

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Melbguy,

This has been passed on to the researchers who will consider an increase for Del Piero or a decrease for Trezeguet the next time Italy is reviewed.

Regards

XXXX

You said: 2008-05-23 16:52:09 BST

thanks XXXX,

So there is no explanation as to why Del Piero is lower then Trez currently?

Could this scenario not be addressed before the next Italian ratings as we are not talking about unknown players so subsequently not much research is really going to be performed.

I have been chasing this down for 2 weeks now so I have become a little fixated on it and am going crazy trying to figure out the reasoning behind the ratings :)

thanks heaps

SM Support said: 2008-05-26 12:59:41 BST

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Melbguy,

The ratings of these two will not be looked at again until the next Italian changes, as I'm sure you can appreciate, giving a new rating to such high profile players outside of the schedule could set a precedent with people demanding new ratings other players outside of the schedule.

Regards

XXXX

==================================

in the mean time, this ticket was closed so opened up another one

==================================

Sorry to take up too much of your time but I dont know what happened to my previous ticket, got an email saying a comment was added, logged onto SM and now I dont have any tickets...

Will there be a response either way to my previous ticket?

You said: 2008-05-13 21:03:22 BST

thought I'll make it a little easier for you to find it: Ticket 700101-12271

SM Support said: 2008-05-13 21:22:12 BST

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Melbguy,

The last response on your ticket was:

"Thank you for this information. I will forward this on to our researchers for them look into."

Regards

XXXXX

You said: 2008-05-19 06:00:34 BST

thanks XXXXX,

was wondering what the process is now as this is my first ever ticket.. it's been a week and am yet to receive a response regarding Del Piero's rating query.

thanks in advance

SM Support said: 2008-05-31 18:16:52 BST

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Melbguy,

Sorry for the delay in responding to this ticket Melbguy. I liaised with the researchers towards the end of last week regarding his current rating and they feel that it is appropriate to represent his current form for Juventus in Serie A. However, if he continues with his form at the Euros and into the 2008/09 season (both in relation to Serie A and the European Cup)then we will review his rating again.

Regards

XXXX

You said: 2008-06-01 00:44:41 BST

Thankyou for your response.

To be fair the question was "why is Del Piero a 93 and Trezequet a 94 when Del Piero has been superior in every statistic besides minutes in the last 2 years at every level" for which I provided all the statistics required for analysis.

Am very interested in the reasoning behind it but I'm accepting the fact that this question will not be answered directly by SM and I will go back to hiding underneath my rock :)

==================================

So yeah, I officially give up:o

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Re: Del Piero vs Trezequet

Also stats man mean so little mate, del piero more goals/assists and everything. But maybe Treza has been better on field contributing other ways, thats why you cannot just purely base players on stats. If this were the case why on Earth is Borrielo only 90 rated, shouldn't he be up to same standard and Del Piero and Treza, especially when the kid plays for a much ter team, thus he needs more of his skill to get the results. Again like i said, havent watched much Serie A this season so i cannot make comments on who is better, but stats can mean nothing mate. As for Appearances in World cup and euro thats because Trezeguet is not liked by the French coach, as you see gets dropped afta a great season and etc. So playing time can't really be the biggest factor. Also goals last season, Jvue very lucky not the drop ratings, goals in Serie B doesnt really rate very high, lucky players stayed above the 90 mark tbh.

ok' date=' I concede defeat, not due to not having a case but to the poor/non ticket responses. Just to close this loop I'm posting the correspondence.

=================================

Hi,

Just querying over Del Piero's rating of 93 while his teammate has a 94.

Below are stats between the 2 all the way back to the World Cup.

2006 World Cup

TZ 3 games - 2 as sub

DP 5 games - 4 as sub

Serie B 06/07

TZ 15 Goals

DP 20 Goals (Top Scorer in league)

UEFA qualification 07/08

TZ 3 games - 1 as sub

DP 5 games - 2 as sub

Serie A 07/08

TZ 19(1) 5 assists 34 games (1 sub) 3030 mins (Currently joint 1st)

DP 18(2) 6 assists 34 games (5 sub) 2712 mins (Currently 2nd)

Coppa Italia 07/08

TZ 0 goals

DP 3 goals

DP had more WC appearances

DP had more goals last season

DP has more appearances for his nation

DP has more assists

DP has more goals this season

Trez has more minutes

I'm been playing the game for a while now and am a little confused (unless I'm missing a stat or have gotten some of them wrong).

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Melbguy,

This has been passed on to the researchers who will consider an increase for Del Piero or a decrease for Trezeguet the next time Italy is reviewed.

Regards

XXXX

thanks XXXX,

So there is no explanation as to why Del Piero is lower then Trez currently?

Could this scenario not be addressed before the next Italian ratings as we are not talking about unknown players so subsequently not much research is really going to be performed.

I have been chasing this down for 2 weeks now so I have become a little fixated on it and am going crazy trying to figure out the reasoning behind the ratings :)

thanks heaps

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Melbguy,

The ratings of these two will not be looked at again until the next Italian changes, as I'm sure you can appreciate, giving a new rating to such high profile players outside of the schedule could set a precedent with people demanding new ratings other players outside of the schedule.

Regards

XXXX

==================================

[i']in the mean time, this ticket was closed so opened up another one[/i]

==================================

Sorry to take up too much of your time but I dont know what happened to my previous ticket, got an email saying a comment was added, logged onto SM and now I dont have any tickets...

Will there be a response either way to my previous ticket?

thought I'll make it a little easier for you to find it: Ticket 700101-12271

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Melbguy,

The last response on your ticket was:

"Thank you for this information. I will forward this on to our researchers for them look into."

Regards

XXXXX

thanks XXXXX,

was wondering what the process is now as this is my first ever ticket.. it's been a week and am yet to receive a response regarding Del Piero's rating query.

thanks in advance

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Melbguy,

Sorry for the delay in responding to this ticket Melbguy. I liaised with the researchers towards the end of last week regarding his current rating and they feel that it is appropriate to represent his current form for Juventus in Serie A. However, if he continues with his form at the Euros and into the 2008/09 season (both in relation to Serie A and the European Cup)then we will review his rating again.

Regards

XXXX

Thankyou for your response.

To be fair the question was "why is Del Piero a 93 and Trezequet a 94 when Del Piero has been superior in every statistic besides minutes in the last 2 years at every level" for which I provided all the statistics required for analysis.

Am very interested in the reasoning behind it but I'm accepting the fact that this question will not be answered directly by SM and I will go back to hiding underneath my rock :)

==================================

So yeah, I officially give up:o

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Guest melbguy1

Re: Del Piero vs Trezequet

Also stats man mean so little mate' date=' del piero more goals/assists and everything. But maybe Treza has been better on field contributing other ways, thats why you cannot just purely base players on stats. If this were the case why on Earth is Borrielo only 90 rated, shouldn't he be up to same standard and Del Piero and Treza, especially when the kid plays for a much ter team, thus he needs more of his skill to get the results. Again like i said, havent watched much Serie A this season so i cannot make comments on who is better, but stats can mean nothing mate. As for Appearances in World cup and euro thats because Trezeguet is not liked by the French coach, as you see gets dropped afta a great season and etc. So playing time can't really be the biggest factor. Also goals last season, Jvue very lucky not the drop ratings, goals in Serie B doesnt really rate very high, lucky players stayed above the 90 mark tbh.[/quote']

I understand what your saying, but I think you will find it a hard task to find someone who has watched Juve games say that Trez has been better/more valuable then DP this season (or last season for that matter). You may find some that say he has played just as well as DP (like me) but not better then him. They have both been in awesome form this year.

Borriello being a 90 is too low imo, but he only scored 1 goal last season and tbh comparing Borriello, a one season wonder (so far) to the likes of DP and Trez who have been doing this for ten years now is not being fair to DP or Trez.

As for the goals last year, yeah I know it's not as important, but its a comparison between these 2 players as they were both in the same situation.

As for their ratings last year, SM (sort of) came out on another thread and said that their ratings were frozen for that year, that's unless your saying that the world best keeper should be a 89 along with Trez, DP, Camo and Ned.

As for the 'stats mean so little' comment, your right, SM pick and choose when stats are important and when they are not.

At the end of the day, I've watched almost every Juve game this season and I love/adore Trez as much as DP (ok, maybe DP a teeny weeny bit more), but don't see how Trez could be rated higher than DP, and an answer would have been nice since I put it all together nicely for them.

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Guest melbguy1

Re: Del Piero vs Trezequet

ok, I know i said it was over but I got a response from SM on my closing remark which was:

======================

Thankyou for your response.

To be fair the question was "why is Del Piero a 93 and Trezequet a 94 when Del Piero has been superior in every statistic besides minutes in the last 2 years at every level" for which I provided all the statistics required for analysis.

Am very interested in the reasoning behind it but I'm accepting the fact that this question will not be answered directly by SM and I will go back to hiding underneath my rock :)

============================

response

============================

Hi Melbguy,

If you view the 'What Can Influence a Rating?' section within the online help you will see factors of what can have an effect on a player rating. You have to understand that players plying their trade in certain leagues (eg La Liga, Bundesliga, Serie A etc) will find it harder to move ratings once they hit the high 80 ratings unless they prove themselves on a regular basis.

To be honest I personally believe that his lack of European football for the past two seasons has contributed to his rating and the same can be said for his international appearances. However, he could have another rating increase if he has a good Euro 2008 and then continues his excellent form into the 2008/09 Serie A season and also into the European Cup.

Regards

XXXX

===========================

Is SM really that stupid that they can't read, or was it a response from a 14 year old forumer:rolleyes:

Again they don't answer my question but answer the question they wished I asked.:rolleyes:

Notice how the EPL is not included in leagues that players need to "prove themselves on a regular basis." , although being the only Italian to appear in 4 European cups and the leading goal scorer and appearances at a huge club like Juventus is not "proving himself on a regular basis".

Fark mate, there are 2 players on his team that have a higher rating then him without 'european games' and 1 with poor 'International appearances'.

At the end of the day they are a bunch of English twots that continue to glorify and overyhpe their own league without having a clue at what happens outside of skysports. It's amazing how EPL 'older' team stars/icons don't have to be a first team regular but are still able to atain a rating that DP has/had but DP has actually been performing.

Yeah, thanks mate "he could have another rating increase if he has a good Euro 2008 and then continues his excellent form into the 2008/09 Serie A season and also into the European Cup." Noooo :rolleyes: really :rolleyes: for real? :rolleyes: ... idiots.

If you think this is harsh, wait for my post when DP wins the Serie A player of the year award.

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Re: Del Piero vs Trezequet

If he does lol. You really do love him don't you? Palermo and Palacio are in a simialr position, maybe even worse. Look at their records over the last couple of years and it's Palermo that should be the highest. The specialist's have their favourites so they will never all be right, never. The only difference is one's a CF and the other a F, in both cases, but they are the other way round in terms of rating/performances. In one the CF seems to getting the good end of the stick whilst it's the F in the other, so who knows how they are doing them.

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Re: Del Piero vs Trezequet

ok' date=' I know i said it was over but I got a response from SM on my closing remark which was:

======================

Thankyou for your response.

To be fair the question was "why is Del Piero a 93 and Trezequet a 94 when Del Piero has been superior in every statistic besides minutes in the last 2 years at every level" for which I provided all the statistics required for analysis.

Am very interested in the reasoning behind it but I'm accepting the fact that this question will not be answered directly by SM and I will go back to hiding underneath my rock :)

============================

response

============================

Hi Melbguy,

If you view the 'What Can Influence a Rating?' section within the online help you will see factors of what can have an effect on a player rating. You have to understand that players plying their trade in certain leagues (eg La Liga, Bundesliga, Serie A etc) will find it harder to move ratings once they hit the high 80 ratings unless they prove themselves on a regular basis.

To be honest I personally believe that his lack of European football for the past two seasons has contributed to his rating and the same can be said for his international appearances. However, he could have another rating increase if he has a good Euro 2008 and then continues his excellent form into the 2008/09 Serie A season and also into the European Cup.

Regards

XXXX

===========================

Is SM really that stupid that they can't read, or was it a response from a 14 year old forumer:rolleyes:

Again they don't answer my question but answer the question they wished I asked.:rolleyes:

Notice how the EPL is not included in leagues that players need to "prove themselves on a regular basis." , although being the only Italian to appear in 4 European cups and the leading goal scorer and appearances at a huge club like Juventus is not "proving himself on a regular basis".

Fark mate, there are 2 players on his team that have a higher rating then him without 'european games' and 1 with poor 'International appearances'.

At the end of the day they are a bunch of English twots that continue to glorify and overyhpe their own league without having a clue at what happens outside of skysports. It's amazing how EPL 'older' team stars/icons don't have to be a first team regular but are still able to atain a rating that DP has/had but DP has actually been performing.

Yeah, thanks mate "he could have another rating increase if he has a good Euro 2008 and then continues his excellent form into the 2008/09 Serie A season and also into the European Cup." Noooo :rolleyes: really :rolleyes: for real? :rolleyes: ... idiots.

If you think this is harsh, wait for my post when DP wins the Serie A player of the year award.

mate, i TOTALLY AGREE.

i look forward to reading your thrashing on SM's DP 93 Rating.

Give 'em Heck

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Re: Del Piero vs Trezequet

However' date=' he could have another rating increase if he has a good Euro 2008 and then continues his excellent form into the 2008/09 Serie A season and also into the European Cup.

Regards

XXXX[/size']

it looks like it's been done all before.

since the last rating change according to his profile page on 07-5-2008 Del Piero has scored 6 Serie A goals in 12 games that also includes 2 penalties that he gave away 1 to Trezequet in the last game of last year and 1 to Iaquinta a couple of weeks ago, along with heaps of assists and overall top performances in those games

4 goals in 4 games against top opposition in Champions league along with a couple of goals in the qualifyaing stages along with 2 man of the match awards.

the only downside is that his euro was average but he has continued his overall fantastic form. doesnt really make sense because surey they cant take away points from him for 4 games in euro over the rest of the games he has played.

what does SM consider top form if that is not considered top form?

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