Phelps v Lewis v Redgrave

[Smartdoc 5,262]

What an athlete Michael Phelps is. Breaking all kind of records, winning all events by large margins and more golds than most of the world's countries combined (as Gizb pointed out on the Olympic thread). I really don't want to take anything away from his marvellous achievements and he deserves all the accolades he is getting. He's already amassed more Golds than anyone in olympic history and god knows what his final tally will be.

However, does this make him the greatest olympian already. I really don't want to belittle his achievements, but my own feeling is that there are too many gold medals for what I consider similar events in Swimming. As an ex-club and county swimmer myself, I know that the strokes are not as different as they would seem to appear to spectators. I got to C level at county grade before my studies took over. I was too good for C level but probably not quite a B level swimmer. In swimming, unlike athletics, you aren't necessarily just good at one discipline. At my level I was the best at all strokes, through all distances. Whereas the best 100m runner in Athletics will be rubbish at 800m, in swimming, in all probability, the best at 100m will be the best at 800m.

So perhaps in this case Carl Lewis should still rank above him. Does Phelps 12 golds compare favourably to Lewis' 9 golds. His were in a variety of events includin 100m, 200m, long jump and relay events. Again there is some similarity between the events in that they are all speed disciplines, but we don't see that many athletes who have repeated Lewis' accomplishments whereas there are many other swimmers who have won multiple golds.

But what then of someone like Steve Redgrave. Only four golds but does this mean he is only one-third or one-half of a great olympian as compared to these other two. Perhaps his is the best achievement as although he only competes in one event, he managed to win golds in 4 consecutive olympics, something very few will achieve. There would he other examples of olmpians who have competed in 4 consecutive olympics and won 4 golds , I'm sure but Redgrave is the one which comes to mind at this moment.

So what do you think?

EDIT: I've just seen in the news that Linford Christie feels Carl Lewis's achievements still rank above Phelps. Is this fellow sprinter bias or is he right?

[TomOwen 8,151]

Re: Phelps v Lewis v Redgrave

It's simply Michael Phelps. Winning 12 gold medals in the Olympics is clearly something that everybody would dream of doing. And he can make it 14 very soon. He has won gold medals in the following events...

200m Individual Medley

400m Individual Medley

4 x 100m Freestyle Relay

200m Freestyle

200m Butterfly

4 x 200m Freestyle Relay.

As you can see, he has pretty much won 4 events which gave him 6 gold medals. And the relays were not only given to him by his own efforts, but three other Americans, which shows how good the Americans are at swimming. Michael Phelps has the ability to swim all four strokes with an amazing speed and his winning in Individual Medley's show that. He is currently the best swimmer in the world.

Michael Phelps currently hold a couple world records and if you watched him swim, you could see that he easily beat the other opponents with a few seconds to spare as well as easily beating the world records that he set himself. Compared to Carl Lewis and Redgrave, he actually holds World Records and has won a total of 14 medals in the Olympics (12 Gold and 2 Bronze) proves that he is probably the best Olympiad in history.

[Guest melbguy1]

Re: Phelps v Lewis v Redgrave

Ian Thorpe must get a mention.

I'm not a swimming expert but it did appear that the competition was alot tougher when Thorpe was winning all his gold as compared to nowadays where Phelps seems to stand above an average period for swimmers.

Then again I may just be biased.

[Smartdoc 5,262]

Re: Phelps v Lewis v Redgrave

Very fair points and a good summary of Phelp's amazing achievements! How much he has achieved for someone so young. To think if he could lengthen his career to the London Olympics he may get to 20+ golds Yet I'm still not sure to be honest.

World records are very much commonplace in swimming. Most major swimming meets result in a string of world records being broken due to the continuing improvemnt in the wetsuits which companies such as Speedo produce. Yet they are much less common in athletics and rowing (to an axtent). some athletics world records have stood for 60 years+. Carl Lewis also broke world records during his time in the various olympic games he competed in. His 4*100m world record with his fellow team mates still stands. Similarly Redgrave and Pinsent were the world record holders for a time in their rowing pairs event.

Similarly, just as Phelps is thrashing all his fellow competitors, Lewis and Redgrave also swept all before them during their olympic successes. Showing my age here but I remember them well

Also to be at the top of your sport for 4 or even 8 years is amazing. But to continue to dominate your sport for 16 years, regardless what your sport is, is no mean feat. I really can't decide ebtween the three. Should Phelps go onto be as successful in London, well then the case is closed I beleive. But until then my vote goes for 'we'll have to wait and see'

EDIT: Just seen Melbguy's post and he's right. I'm sure a few others are worth a mention in various sports also

[kingjamie 30]

Re: Phelps v Lewis v Redgrave

Redgrave For Me, Anyone Who Can Stay On The Top Of World Sports For 16 Years Is Amazing The Other Two Contenders Are Both Fantastic But It's Redgrave's Longevity That Wins It For Him. If Phelps Is Winning Golds In London I Might Change My Mind Because Swimmers Tend To Retire At 25 And In London He Will Be 27 In 2012. Though I Think Phelps Like Thorpe In Athens Is At The Peak Of His Short Career.

PS SmartDoc, Redgrave won 5 Golds In A Consecutive Olyimpics (1984-2000), 2 In Coxed Four, 3 In Coxless Pair. He Also Got Bronze In 1988, Which I Think Where Your Consecutive Statement Came In.

[TomOwen 8,151]

Re: Phelps v Lewis v Redgrave

Michael Phelps has won his seventh gold medal this season, winning the gold medal in the 100m butterfly. He now has 13 gold medals and that is four more than any Olympian in history, Mark Spitz, Carl Lewis, Paavo Nurmi and Larysa Latynina, who is actually deemed by many experts as the best Olympian in history, not the three mentioned above, because of the much so competition in the gymnastics competition.

Michael Phelps is one gold medal away!

[pthame 3d 295]

Re: Phelps v Lewis v Redgrave

Michael Phelps. Without a shadow of a doubt, and if anyone disagrees with me, they should try and do what he does every day all year around.

Those who say its easier for him to get the records and medals in the water are completely up the wrong tree. I was reading an article on MSN where he eats up to 12,000 calories worth of food just to stay in the condition he is and for him to stay energized whilst he is swimming. Plus, even away from the competitive pools, it said he swims something up to 5 HOURS a day. If any of us were to eat 12,000 calories a day and do not much else during the day, hospitals would be having full wards where people are having heart attacks.

Winning 7 medals is an amazing achievement in any walk of life, and winning 13 Olympic medals in his career is an achievement in all senses of the word. Michael Phelps is simply the best in my opinion, again, people who say that its easier in the water to win all his medals, should try walking the walk before they criticize him again.

[studge 1,894]

Re: Phelps v Lewis v Redgrave

Phelps has lots of gold medals in basicly the same event. I would be more impressed if someone won as many gold medals in a variation of events that are different, rather than competing 5+ times than in events thats all the same.

[James C 1,084]

Re: Phelps v Lewis v Redgrave

Gotta be phelps now

he has just won his 8th gold in 8 days, breaking the world record.

[liverpool123 21]

Re: Phelps v Lewis v Redgrave

i put phelps to olympion but time a brit contested with him and became the greatest ever olympion.

[Danny_Williams 1,111]

Re: Phelps v Lewis v Redgrave

Best Olympian of all time is Jesse Owens.

Not just for what he did but how and where he did it, Hitler's Berlin Olympic games.

Track and Field which imo is the true Olympic category is what he dominated with 4 Golds in 100m,200m,4x100m relay and Long jump.

At this time Hitler and the Nazis were all about racial discrimination and for a black athlete to even perform in those Olympics was a surprise but he made the 'Super Race' of Germans look extremely bad.

[liverpool123 21]

Re: Phelps v Lewis v Redgrave

Best Olympian of all time is Jesse Owens.

Not just for what he did but how and where he did it' date=' Hitler's Berlin Olympic games.

Track and Field which imo is the true Olympic category is what he dominated with 4 Golds in 100m,200m,4x100m relay and Long jump.

At this time Hitler and the Nazis were all about racial discrimination and for a black athlete to even perform in those Olympics was a surprise but he made the 'Super Race' of Germans look extremely bad. [/quote']

Yeah great point there mate he came and 'made it' at probaly the hardest time to win an olympic gold with hitlers discrimination. i think that he should go down as a true legend that beat discrimination but maye not the greatest ever olympion as phelps may still have another olympics in his sights. but i must have to agree with you but i think that i think that he would be the greatest ever olympion that beat discrimination or racism as there are other olympions that have won the same amount of medals but maybe only had to beat their opponents not discrimination.

[Danny_Williams 1,111]

Re: Phelps v Lewis v Redgrave

Yeah great point there mate he came and 'made it' at probaly the hardest time to win an olympic gold with hitlers discrimination. i think that he should go down as a true legend that beat discrimination but maye not the greatest ever olympion as phelps may still have another olympics in his sights. but i must have to agree with you but i think that i think that he would be the greatest ever olympion that beat discrimination or racism as there are other olympions that have won the same amount of medals but maybe only had to beat their opponents not discrimination.

Phelps is by far the best 'Swimming' Olympian but all swimming events are very similar..Same for Redgrave.

Track and Field athletes automatically gain the most respect for me, they have to perform in more than one event all very different to each other.

[liverpool123 21]

Re: Phelps v Lewis v Redgrave

Phelps is by far the best 'Swimming' Olympian but all swimming events are very similar..Same for Redgrave.

Track and Field athletes automatically gain the most respect for me' date=' they have to perform in more than one event all very different to each other.[/quote']

Yeah i can see your point that track and field are more different to each other.

But as i am not a track specalist i think that swimming is one of the hardest sports as some of the strokes are totally different. but i thinks that if you were to look at the medal count phelps is top.

So therefore i would sway to him looking on medal counts but if i were to choose the greatest olympian i would choose jessy owens becasue he beat discrimination but maybe track and pool events should be judged differently?

[Motty 102]

Re: Phelps v Lewis v Redgrave

Tempted to vote for Redgrave, but in the end, I wasnt sure enough so voted for that section.