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Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Thread


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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

In fairness Dunga picked Ronaldinho pretty consistently for around 3 years before he lost patience with his continually lacklustre displays and ditched him. Personally I'd have liked to see him included as a Plan B for Kaka' date=' who looks short of a deputy at the moment, but he can't complain that he hasn't been given opportunities, he just failed to take them.[/quote']

That's what I meant with my last point - The starting XI can do whatever they want and they'll still be starters for the next game. No matter what, Dinho should have been going to WC. If not as a starter, then as an option for Kaka. I would have loved to see Dinho get a chance during this year friendlies, beacuse do remember that the years after WC and pre-09, wasn't his best years and he has totally changed both in playing-style and in personal attitude. It would have been really nice to see him getting as shot as a starter against Ireland during the March friendlies to see if he still has what it takes, but he didn't and I cannot help but to blame Dunga for this stupid descison, beacuse like I said, he has changed.

Pato's more complex' date=' but I can see the logic there. There's the fact he's never really done it for Brazil (albeit in relatively restricted appearances) plus there's not a role in the team that really looks a natural fit for him. Again, he would have been an interesting Plan B to have available but I think it's telling that more of the clamour from Brazil was for Neymar or Ganso than Pato.[/quote']

Well, this season at Milan he has adopted relative well to the right-wing role and I could have really been seeing as an option to Elano at the right-flank if Brazil are down under. He would have been giving speed and creativity to this squad, who lacks at this.

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

Cannot physically wait for the spain game, I have my massive flag and my kit and my face paint its gonna be awesome I really hope they dont flop under the pressure of being favourites. Pity I have a stupid German exam which will make me a few minutes late.

This has been the worst start to a world cup ever, everyone but Germany have really not preformed its just been boring draws after boring draws.

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

That's what I meant with my last point - The starting XI can do whatever they want and they'll still be starters for the next game. No matter what' date=' Dinho should have been going to WC. If not as a starter, then as an option for Kaka. I would have loved to see Dinho get a chance during this year friendlies, beacuse do remember that the years after WC and pre-09, wasn't his best years and he has totally changed both in playing-style and in personal attitude. It would have been really nice to see him getting as shot as a starter against Ireland during the March friendlies to see if he still has what it takes, but he didn't and I cannot help but to blame Dunga for this stupid descison, beacuse like I said, he has changed.[/quote']

I don't disagree with you as such, I'd have probably leaned towards taking him because if Kaka breaks down they look in trouble. But he had a long spell to get fit and prove he was interested in playing for Brazil. Perhaps in Dunga's mind he wishes to reward the players that showed professionalism and desire throughout his 4 year spell, rather than for 12 months because it was a World Cup year. As you said, he's all about the group over the individual.

Well, this season at Milan he has adopted relative well to the right-wing role and I could have really been seeing as an option to Elano at the right-flank if Brazil are down under. He would have been giving speed and creativity to this squad, who lacks at this.

I don't think he could carry out that role in the way that Dunga wants it to be played. Noticeable that it's been mainly filled by Ramires and Elano who are more noted as midfield players than attackers. There's definately a defensive element to the right sided position that would lend itself more to a genuine midfield player than a converted support striker/winger.

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

Ivory coast should have started with the Drog imo, his cast didn't seem to affect his performance plus there were a few good balls into the box that he would have scored had he been on the end of them. The so called group of death was just as drab as the other groups so far. Can't wait for the Spain game, I seriously hope round two of the group games produces more goals.

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

Best game ive seen so far from the WC i think. Although the Germany game is'nt too far behind.

Brazil were struggling abit and like someone said i think its clear the weather got to them a bit' date=' but they should have rise above it.

There were signs of class but i still thinks theres alot more to come, and as for N.Korea i was bloody impressed, i honestly thought Brazil would breaze that game but they stuck at their guns and finally got their reward, their goal was fully deserved.

As for Maicon MoM, i dont think so. Probably Robinho, although for some reasons i thought Juan had a good game? :S Anyway, i still think Maicon's goal was the best yet - Intentional or not. :P[/quote']

Maicon was immense. Robinho, in my opinion, was not so good on first half. Yes, the attacks passed by him, but he was able to jam the game almost every time. Of course, North Korean defence had their part to it, but one always only plays against an opponent. Maicon was probably the most productive Brasilian. Stats wise he was more accurate shooter than Robinho who wasted 5 chances with wide shots, more active accurate passer even when only considering long or medium long passes (interestingly, he was less active in short passes but still more accurate), better and more active crosser (ok, not hard task as Robinho didn't complete one single cross). More importantly, Maicon delivered the ball successfully (i.e. own player getting it) to the penalty are 4 times against Robinho's only one time. In fact, no other player of Brazil delivered the ball to penalty area successfully twice except for Maicon, who did it half the times of Brazil (4 times out of 8). He also did the most solo runs with 11, although Robinho evens him here. 9 of Brazil's 19 attacks came from Maicon's right flank that he dominated single handedly. Add to that the genial goal from what didn't look like a serious chance, and very decisive one too, because it forced North Korea to open up their defence. There's no way that anyone else than Maicon could have been the man of the match. This time it was clear. Oh, these are official stats by FIFA, I checked them because I was sure that Maicon's dominance of game shows in stats too. It truly does, you can go check them yourself too if you want.

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

I guess the Portugal vs Ivory Coast untill now was the game more decisive or would be. Theorically was a game between the two teams that were fighting for the 2nd place and who would have lost, would automatically be out of the qualification to the next round. I say more decisive, because theorically the NK is the poorest and no one expects them to take points from others. Wasn't surely the best game and i never expected it, but was emotive. The fear of suffer a goal was higher than the wish to score. And when it happens is hard to see an attractive game.

Portugal had space to create the attack, but just in defense, i guess our major problem was lose the patience and quickly. We started well the game, circulating the ball and was when we had the Ronaldo chance. After it, bad passes in midfield, our players tryed do things fast and only made it worst. 2nd half, they started better, but our counter attacks not resulted.. IC played worst since Drogba joined. They had more apparent danger than us, but their biggest chance was no close of our best chance.

I think the draw is a good result if we win next game against Korea and Brazil do the same against Ivory Coast. If Brazil is already qualified in the last game, i doubt they will not help us to qualify.

I hope Queiroz replaces Paulo Ferreira for Miguel and Danny by Simão. Miguel is more fast and is better attacking than Ferreira. And we will need attacking side backs in next game. Danny made a bad game(as Deco) and he is better when plays as sub in..

One thing that i found fantastic, was the NK players crying when they were singing their anthem..

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

Well' date=' this season at Milan he has adopted relative well to the right-wing role and I could have really been seeing as an option to Elano at the right-flank if Brazil are down under. He would have been giving speed and creativity to this squad, who lacks at this.[/quote']

Notice that Dunga's Brazil doesn't really use wingers, all midfielders and attackers play relatively middle.

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

I didn't mind Drogba not starting... As I have no idea the extent of his injury.

But that said I really think that the infamous Sven blew that match. The time to attack Portugal was when Simao was off the pitch. I can understand that there is a feeling-out process for the first 10 min or so' date=' but after that Sven should have had the Elephants attack attack attack. YaYa and the rest of the midfield were more than enough to stop any Portuguese counter-attack as long as Simao was off the pitch.

[b']

Then after the half, Sven put himself in a position [/b]where he only gave his team 10 minutes to all-out-attack before Simao was brought on.

How people are willing to pay that guy for non-result after non-result after disastrous campaign is beyond me. I bet you anything that heis thinking to himself tonight that he should have taken the North Korean job...:rolleyes:

While I share your wider opinion on Sven, all I'd say for him in this case is that the Ivory Coast we saw in Angola earlier on in the year would have been picked off by this Portugal side with relative ease. What he's done might not particularly pretty, but at least he's got them organised. Whether he's gone too far to the other extreme is a valid question though.

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

This North Korean defence will be very hard to crack for all teams. There were three key elements in my opinion:

1. Discipline. The way they kept the distance to each other must be admired, their positional game blocked a huge amount off Brazil's passes and crosses without tackles. I really would like to see that in France's game too.

2. Tackling. When needed, they tackled with rigour. It is so nice to see clean tackling instead all this kicking in the legs that most "well defending" teams do. Their tackles were so fine and pure, loved that.

3. Running. Really tireless, fast running, be it that very lazily advancing Brzil gave them lots of chances to recover. Anyway, that's workmanship.

Now, my ideas how to crack it:

1. Don't give so much time. I think this was Brazil's main problem. They just like to keep the ball too much, not advancing fast enough, and so North Koreans get well needed pauses and are able to reposition. Part of the "discipline" effect must have resulted from this. They were always there to wait for Brazil's attacks right in their places when Brazil got there, but if Brazil only would have attacked faster, perhaps they wouldn't have been able to do that, who knows? Also, perhaps they would tire too, if you would move ball faster. Of course, it may be that it's you who tire first, but it might be worth trying. Usually, good fast passing tires defenders down faster than the attackers. So: fast passing and always forward if possible!

2. Go down the flanks. In the middle it seemed helpless, usually very tight defence is easier to crack through the flanks. Maicon and Bastos were pretty alone in their flanks, and although they did fine, the problems started when Kaka and his friends started to lead the play: they always tried through the middle, which didn't work.

Ivory Coast might be harder to North Korea in this aspect, since they tend to attack down the flanks. Also Netherlands, Italy and Germany might be suiting to crack this defence (and I'd like to say France, but without any real strikers to finish the attacks it remains unclear what is the use of cracking the defence). I'm not saying that Koreans wouldn't make it against them, this seems generally very tough opponent to any team, but I'm just saying that these teams might do it relatively better against Koreans than Brasilians did, or say, Spain would do. Spain could have similar problems with Brazil. I've seen some highlights of goals against Poland, and to be honest, that was so passive defending that it was practically a goal practice. Any aggressively defending team that tries to knock the ball off and move on to trajectories and so on would have survived those attacks. In that SIlva's goal I'm sure that, for example, against France Xavi would have already lost the ball to Toulalan, and I'm pretty sure these Koreans would have taken the ball too.

Brazil finally cracked it because of genial moves, of course. B)

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

Wasn't too impressed by the Brazilians tonight considering they are one of the favourites to win it' date=' although to be fair, NK played very well especially in the first half and they deserved the goal that they scored.

[/quote']

Pity the NK keeper when he gets home, probably get put up against a wall somewhere :(

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

The Ivorians were more organised than their ANC display and for that we can give Sven credit. From what I saw however, Drogba did not look like his cast was affecting him and with the way Ivory Coast were attacking from the flanks I'd expect to see him in the box attacking those balls, a bad decision by the manager imo that could cost them dearly. It is now down to who can score the most against Korea, the next criteria after points is goal difference, so possibly who concedes fewer against Brazil as well.

On the bright side Iniesta is expected to start!!!

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

On the bright side Iniesta is expected to start!!!

Its not sure whether he will or not though, Del Bosque was quoted as saying he has to think about the WC not just Switzerland when asked about Iniesta. He trained fine, but maybe the game is just a little soon? I think it would be wise to bench him and possibly play Navas on the right who will be a more than adequate replacement. Spain should and hopefully beat Switzerland comfortably anyway.

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

Just a side note, European teams aren't doing well. In 10 teams, only 3 won. France, England, Slovakia, Italy and Portugal drew, while Greece, Serbia and Denmark lost. The only teams that won were Slovenia, Germany and Netherlands while Spain and Switzerland play today..

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

Wow' date=' im really disappointed with this WC, 9 wins and 6 draws so far, only Alemania doing a classy game:([/quote']

Personally, I kinda like the low-scoring nature of this WC. It is showing the field is much more even than in previous cups, and because of this goals will be special. Whats more fun to watch? Argentina beating a hapless Bosnia-Herezegovina 6-0, or Argentina playing an even match against Nigeria and barely winning 1-0. I'll go for the latter.

Also, was it just me or did anyone else find themselves rooting for North Korea today? Other than their valiant efforts on the field, I sympathized with the team when they showed their striker crying during the national anthem. We have all these negative feelings towards North Korea, and I think they showed a lot of people that they have somethig to prove. That brilliant goal they scored meant so much to them, and I hope, really hope, they can manage to at least get a tie against either Portugal or Ivory Coast.

EDIT: Also, why does Kaka suck? lol It seemed like every pass he attempted got picked off, and when he got into the final third one on one with a defender, it was blatantly obvious he lacks the creativity to go past a defender. IMO, a vastly over-rated player.

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

Personally' date=' I kinda like the low-scoring nature of this WC. It is showing the field is much more even than in previous cups, and because of this goals will be special. Whats more fun to watch? Argentina beating a hapless Bosnia-Herezegovina 6-0, or Argentina playing an even match against Nigeria and barely winning 1-0. I'll go for the latter.

Also, was it just me or did anyone else find themselves rooting for North Korea today? Other than their valiant efforts on the field, I sympathized with the team when they showed their striker crying during the national anthem. We have all these negative feelings towards North Korea, and I think they showed a lot of people that they have somethig to prove. That brilliant goal they scored meant so much to them, and I hope, really hope, they can manage to at least get a tie against either Portugal or Ivory Coast.

EDIT: Also, why does Kaka suck? lol It seemed like every pass he attempted got picked off, and when he got into the final third one on one with a defender, it was blatantly obvious he lacks the creativity to go past a defender. IMO, a vastly over-rated player.[/quote']

Im pretty sure that more people likes more goals in the WC than tied matches but that's just matter of opinions.

I saw the picture of the Korean striker in ESPN during the hymn.

Spain tomorrow, hopefully it will be a great game as i'll see it in the school lol

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

Personally' date=' I kinda like the low-scoring nature of this WC. It is showing the field is much more even than in previous cups, and because of this goals will be special. Whats more fun to watch? Argentina beating a hapless Bosnia-Herezegovina 6-0, or Argentina playing an even match against Nigeria and barely winning 1-0. I'll go for the latter.

Also, was it just me or did anyone else find themselves rooting for North Korea today? Other than their valiant efforts on the field, I sympathized with the team when they showed their striker crying during the national anthem. We have all these negative feelings towards North Korea, and I think they showed a lot of people that they have somethig to prove. That brilliant goal they scored meant so much to them, and I hope, really hope, they can manage to at least get a tie against either Portugal or Ivory Coast.

EDIT: [b']Also, why does Kaka suck? lol It seemed like every pass he attempted got picked off, and when he got into the final third one on one with a defender, it was blatantly obvious he lacks the creativity to go past a defender. IMO, a vastly over-rated player.[/b]

That was after just one bad game? He had a terrific ConFed Cup. He's coming back from an injury, so it's obvious that he'll take some time to get back to prime form. Infact it's good that he had that bad game against the Koreans and there were others who could do finish the job. He'll slowly get back to his original form. He looked out of sorts yesterday. The body language just wasn't right. He tried a few trickery and cute one touch passing while failed. The whole nation's burden seems to be on his shoulders now pretty much like Rooney, Messi and Ronaldo to name a few. And so far, except Messi, for some good attacking display although he was wasteful when it came to conversion, the others have failed to leave a mark on the WC. Rooney hardly seemed to have the sight of the ball against USA. Ronaldo apart from one long range effort didn't do much. So i think it's unfair to brand Kaka an over-rated player just by this performance. With amount of potential and talent he has, he's sure to be the key against Portugal and Ivory Coast.

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

Its not sure whether he will or not though' date=' Del Bosque was quoted as saying he has to think about the WC not just Switzerland when asked about Iniesta. He trained fine, but maybe the game is just a little soon? I think it would be wise to bench him and possibly play Navas on the right who will be a more than adequate replacement. Spain should and hopefully beat Switzerland comfortably anyway.[/quote']

Some Spanish reports saying that Mata may start. Also, is Torres fit to play? If yes, what formation will VDB use? 4-2-3-1?

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

Personally' date=' I kinda like the low-scoring nature of this WC. It is showing the field is much more even than in previous cups, and because of this goals will be special. Whats more fun to watch? Argentina beating a hapless Bosnia-Herezegovina 6-0, or Argentina playing an even match against Nigeria and barely winning 1-0. I'll go for the latter.

Also, was it just me or did anyone else find themselves rooting for North Korea today? Other than their valiant efforts on the field, I sympathized with the team when they showed their striker crying during the national anthem. We have all these negative feelings towards North Korea, and I think they showed a lot of people that they have somethig to prove. That brilliant goal they scored meant so much to them, and I hope, really hope, they can manage to at least get a tie against either Portugal or Ivory Coast.

EDIT: Also, why does Kaka suck? lol It seemed like every pass he attempted got picked off, and when he got into the final third one on one with a defender, it was blatantly obvious he lacks the creativity to go past a defender. IMO, a vastly over-rated player.[/quote']

I completely agree with this post.

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

That was after just one bad game? He had a terrific ConFed Cup. He's coming back from an injury' date=' so it's obvious that he'll take some time to get back to prime form. Infact it's good that he had that bad game against the Koreans and there were others who could do finish the job. He'll slowly get back to his original form. He looked out of sorts yesterday. The body language just wasn't right. He tried a few trickery and cute one touch passing while failed. The whole nation's burden seems to be on his shoulders now pretty much like Rooney, Messi and Ronaldo to name a few. And so far, except Messi, for some good attacking display although he was wasteful when it came to conversion, the others have failed to leave a mark on the WC. Rooney hardly seemed to have the sight of the ball against USA. Ronaldo apart from one long range effort didn't do much. So i think it's unfair to brand Kaka an over-rated player just by this performance. With amount of potential and talent he has, he's sure to be the key against Portugal and Ivory Coast.[/quote']

You've got a point here, I agree. But it doesn't change that Kaka wasn't good enough against North Korea. In that match he sucked.

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Re: Official FIFA World Cup 2010 Discussions Thread

I don't disagree with you as such' date=' I'd have probably leaned towards taking him because if Kaka breaks down they look in trouble. But he had a long spell to get fit and prove he was interested in playing for Brazil. [b']Perhaps in Dunga's mind he wishes to reward the players that showed professionalism and desire throughout his 4 year spell, rather than for 12 months because it was a World Cup year. As you said, he's all about the group over the individual.[/b]

I understand your point and I agree that he should have been picked as a replacement if Kaka won't perform/get's injured.

But for the bolded part: If that's the case, then I don't know how players like Kleberson, Gilberto, Bastos and Grafite got a chance in the squad. I understand that Bastos was thoughted as a starter and he impressed, but why didn't Dinho get a chance aswell then to prove Dunga that he isn't the player that Dunga kicked out from the team. Kleberson, Gilberto and Grafite won't get a chance in this WC, so I don't see the point in picking them up for the squad. Brazil already has millions of fans around the planet, so I don't see the point in picking up three more players to the squad to provide support.

I don't think he could carry out that role in the way that Dunga wants it to be played. Noticeable that it's been mainly filled by Ramires and Elano who are more noted as midfield players than attackers. There's definately a defensive element to the right sided position that would lend itself more to a genuine midfield player than a converted support striker/winger.

I know, but if Brazil get stucked in a game, they would need to do a drastic change and perhaps shock the opponents and using Pato as a wild card, could perhaps do the game. Brazil has no plan B really and Pato would be an awesome plan B to Elano/Ramires if Brazil are down under. In that way, the opponents don't really know what to do, beacuse they are prepared for an more defensive wide-player to be there, but instead they get an offensive player in Pato.

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