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Official Juventus Thread


mr liucci
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Re: Official juventus fc thread

I have a lot of sympathy for roma actually. They are a club that commands a lot of respect in italy, for their extreme loyalty of their fans (who are completely mental) and that of their home grown players who have always felt attached to the club like a son to his family. Over the years, they have also provided the national team with some excellent players. They are a huge club who underachieved massively over the years(only 3 league titles) , and although they have no european cups, you wouldn’t have guessed that given the quality of players they have had over the years, falcao, bruno conti, agostino di bartolomei, totti etc or from the way they are treated in world football in general(ok, their team anyway, not the fans)

I think I wouldn’t mind if they win something over the next few years, not at the expense of juventus of course, but they are a club that deserves a lot better. They have had more than their share of the bitter, the european cup final defeat on their own turf in 84, the fact they only have 3 league titles, but have finished 2nd on a dozen occasions , the suicide of one of their club legends di bartolomei after suffering severe depression, amist many more tragic events. In a way, my sympathy for this clubs shows very much the state they are in now. 20 years ago, when roma along with juve, formed italy, and europe’s 2 top teams, it would be outrageous to consider a juventino sympathesing with a romanista. But now with roma, with their obvious on-pitch dilemma, their enormous debt left on the club accounts by the now deceased franco sensi(who was well loved by the fans) following years of nonsustainable spending. Add in the fact that spalletti, their immensely likeable manager will probably be sacked within the next fortnight….

I think they deserve better

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Re: Official juventus fc thread

Well' date=' I was wondering the same thing but Abdel Zizi told me they were rested for the UEFA Cup game.

Ok, I'm consfused, are you talking about the Genoa game? because Mexes and Vucinic didn't play.

Tbh your being harsh on Baptista. Arsene Wenger actually wanted to sign him on a permanent too. When on form he is a great player but is just a little inconsistent. I know your a fan of Vucinic, yes he's a good player but he doesn't fit into Spalletti's system that well IMO and isn't the proven goalscorer that Roma desperately need. Mexes on the other hand is IMO one of the best CBs in the world. One of my favourite players, he is pure class.[/quote']

I thought you were talking about resting players in todays game. Did he want to sign him on a permanent basis? I doubt that, from what I can remember Baptista wanted to make it a permanent move but Arsene opted not to. (Probs cause Reyes wouldn't go to Madrid, still didn't make an effort to sign him). For a playmaker I don't think hes that good and nowhere near the player he was at Sevilla. He has the ability but it needs to be fulfilled. As for Vucinic, I think he could fit into the Roma system. Take out either Taddei or Menez and slot him in a wide position. Its his best position I feel anyway, coming in from the wide. But maybe Spalletti will change his formation now and play with 2 forwards - as tonight when Vucinic came on he made a difference. Anyway, back to Juve.... :D

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Guest Daragh

Re: Official juventus fc thread

I thought you were talking about resting players in todays game. Did he want to sign him on a permanent basis? I doubt that' date=' from what I can remember Baptista wanted to make it a permanent move but Arsene opted not to. (Probs cause Reyes wouldn't go to Madrid, still didn't make an effort to sign him). For a playmaker I don't think hes that good and nowhere near the player he was at Sevilla. He has the ability but it needs to be fulfilled. As for Vucinic, I think he could fit into the Roma system. Take out either Taddei or Menez and slot him in a wide position. Its his best position I feel anyway, coming in from the wide. But maybe Spalletti will change his formation now and play with 2 forwards - as tonight when Vucinic came on he made a difference. Anyway, back to Juve.... :D[/quote']

No, I was talking about the Genoa game. Mexes, Juan, Baptista and Vucinic all didn't play.

I'm pretty sure Wenger wanted to sign him but for some reason or another (which I forget) he didn't. I'm sure an Arsenal fan will know more as i heard it from someone on here and from someone else. Like I said, he is inconsistent, he has shown glimpses of what he can do everywhere hes been but just has to produce it on a regular basis, he just needs to become more consistent.

As for Vucinic, he's a good player but like I said before he doesn't fit into Spalletti's system that well IMO and isn't the proven goalscorer that Roma desperately need. Putting him out wide? Well, I wouldn't drop Taddei, as for Menez, yes I've said before on the Serie A thread that he can be very frustrating to watch at times but he is very intelligent on and off (which is just as important) the ball. He makes some very intelligent runs. And obviously his main attributes, his pace and footwork can be a nightmare for defences. I would rather play two natural out and out wingers instead. Totti wasn't fully fit for much of last season and still managed to score 13 goals in 22 league starts. That IMO proves that Totti should be well capable of scoring his fair share of goals this season and with Taddei and Menez out wide, he should have plenty chances. But they still desperately need a proven goal scorer.....

Anyway, back on topic :D

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Re: Official juventus fc thread

LOL ' date=' Lescott was bought at around the same price as Diego xD[/quote']

lescott isnt as bad a deal as people make it out to be. city took the star player of one of their main league rivals. of course it aint gonna be cheap. plus, i remember pepe was bought for 30million euros, and he s by no means a better defender than lescott

i think city spent a lot of money, but they also brought in a lot of players. their fee per player is actually fairly reasonable.

the club who distorted the transfer market is real madrid. they clearly have a currency of their own, RM euro. where 1 normal euro=2.5 RM euro. also, if the player they are after is good looking and has a cool hairdo, you may also add 20million euros to the asking price

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Re: Official juventus fc thread

As most people on here know I am a massive Liverpool fan but what with a little baby girl I dont get out much nowdays-thats babies for you!! I get to watch a lot of footy from around the globe

Due to the wonders that are ESPN I have been watching the early stages of the Italian season and I have to say I am genuinely impressed with Juventus thus far, whilst it would be rash to make snap judgements after only 2games and I certainly wont Juventus have already began to look much superior to the teams of the last few years and appear to be coming to the fore...it has taken sometime after the match fixing scandal which they were rightly punished for but the old lady are one of Europes great clubs and it is good to see them coming back and they should hopefully provide some competition to Internazionale this year.

All the signs are great in Buffon you have one of the top 3keepers in world football, the defence looks fairly solid Chiellini is a class act and Cannavaro will be more effective in Italian football i feel as the pace of the game is slower and even though he is ageing he can still use his experience and knowledge of the Italian game to good effect. I would be slightly worried about the full back areas and personally I do not rsate Grosso that highly so not sure he is the answer to that troublesome LB area.

Plenty of options in midfield now and the new guys Diego and Felipe Melo are quality footballers exactly the right level of signing Juve need and already in the 2games this season Diego has looked a class apart whilst Melo was certainly tidy and very effective against Roma on Debut and having seen him play for the Brazilian NT I am convinced of his qualities. Marchisio,Giovinco,Sissoko,Camaronesi etc midfield looks very strong whilst Upfront Amauri,Iaquinta are very good players not top top level but very good players and with DEl piero still chipping in off the bench etc I think all the signs are there that this could be the year when the old lady comes back to the summit of Italian football....as a neutral (at least in Italy :) ) it would be great to see as we do not want Internazionales dominance continuing forever, Milan well you saw on Saturday are not ready, Roma are not the side they were and Fiorentina are a decent side but not good enough to challenge for the tile leaving Juve as the only realistic challengers in my eyes.

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Re: Official juventus fc thread

lescott isnt as bad a deal as people make it out to be. city took the star player of one of their main league rivals. of course it aint gonna be cheap. plus' date=' i remember pepe was bought for 30million euros, and he s by no means a better defender than lescott

i think city spent a lot of money, but they also brought in a lot of players. their fee per player is actually fairly reasonable.

the club who distorted the transfer market is real madrid. they clearly have a currency of their own, RM euro. where 1 normal euro=2.5 RM euro. also, if the player they are after is good looking and has a cool hairdo, you may also add 20million euros to the asking price[/quote']

To be fair, Lescott wasn't even Everton's best defender! :D

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Re: Official juventus fc thread

To be fair' date=' Lescott wasn't even Everton's best defender! :D[/quote']

A good bit of business by Everton no doubt, selling him on and managing to bring in Distin, Heitinga and Bilyaletdinov and having some money in the bank as well :)

Anyway moving back to Juventus, I share Ray's doubts about Grosso, but it is no doubt a shrewd bit of business at a reported 2m Euros fee (+/- bonuses) :eek:. It's rare to get players of international levels at such a low price and whilst he may not be the best full back in the world, he's certainly no mug and will no doubt be reliable amongst his compatriots from the national side in defence.

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Re: Official juventus fc thread

Giovinco is a very big talent and you should keep him, although , I'm unsure about his rising.

lescott isnt as bad a deal as people make it out to be. city took the star player of one of their main league rivals. of course it aint gonna be cheap. plus' date=' i remember pepe was bought for 30million euros, and he s by no means a better defender than lescott

i think city spent a lot of money, but they also brought in a lot of players. their fee per player is actually fairly reasonable.

the club who distorted the transfer market is real madrid. they clearly have a currency of their own, RM euro. where 1 normal euro=2.5 RM euro. also, if the player they are after is good looking and has a cool hairdo, you may also add 20million euros to the asking price[/quote']

To be honest, I think Everton became stronger with the sell of Lescott. One unhappy player less, 3 new motivated players in. Also, I'm pretty sure Pepe is a way better defender then Lescott, however, it seems, that he has , mmm, issues.

lol @ RM prices. Sad, ain't it?

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Re: Official juventus fc thread

Giovinco is a very big talent and you should keep him' date=' although , I'm unsure about his rising.

To be honest, I think Everton became stronger with the sell of Lescott. One unhappy player less, 3 new motivated players in. [b']Also, I'm pretty sure Pepe is a way better defender then Lescott[/b], however, it seems, that he has , mmm, issues.

lol @ RM prices. Sad, ain't it?

i would be prepared to argue with a pretty strong case that pepe is not a better defender than lescott. and i ve phrased that carefully so as to not be ambiguous when i make my arguement

yes perhaps pepe has more recognition on the international stage, being a first choice centreback for his country. but let's not forget which country he plays for... portugal, not italy, not germany, but portugal, who are hardly reknown for their defensive solidarity. i ve seen highlights of some of their games, competitive and friendly over the last few years, even with other decent defenders like bruno alves and ricardo carvalho, portugal are incredibly frail at the back. you want an example? just look at their 6-2 defeat to brazil. friendly or no friendly, pepe's performance was so bad it bouldered a comedy show

meanwhile lescott has 2 of the best centrebacks in the world ahead of him on the national stage(JT i dont actually rate as much now, i think lescott is more well rounded player than JT, faster sharper on the ground, but it seems JT's experience, strength and courage cant be dismissed easily). if any of these 2 is injuried, i fancy lescott as firm favorite as 1st choice backup. lescott at everton provided a solid foundation for moyes' not so talented side to overachieve the way he did over the last 3 seasons.

i mean last season, i watched 2 liverpool derbies within the space of a fortnight.the fa cup tie with replay. both games, lescott played exceptionally well, and i would go as far as to say he had torres in his back pocket in both games. contrast that with how pepe handled torres at anfield in the CL, to quote Jose mourinho, "it was like watching a donkey getting whipped on a beach in portugal".

now i know i should not purely judge players by their performance in a single game(because the entire madrid team was diabolical on the night). but i ve watched enough of pepe's games, against roma 2 years ago, at the euros last year, against juventus and lfc this year to judge him. and i see a talented young defender, technically good, but is error prone, and not as commanding in the box as his physique would suggest, and does not make enough critical tackles. better than lescott? more experienced on the big stage maybe. but not an obvious "better". if you are arguing that pepe is a better footballer, maybe, but a better defender? no. but of course my argument is partially flawed because pepe is a lot younger than lescott and by the time he gets to lescott's age, he will certainly become a better player than lescott. but right now, if i had to pick between the 2 for a must win game, i would pick lescott

but all of this is just my personal interpretation. often, i sound more sure than i actually am. but having watched plenty of lescott, and enough of pepe, i personally think i can judge them fairly. there is nothing in it tbh. i cant say one is better than the other, but i CAN say that one is probably not better than the other. if you get my gist.

i write of this just to make sure people realise that i wouldnt make "ludicrous claims" if i didnt have reasons to back it up with lol. and once you read this, maybe you wont think my claims are so ludicrous.

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Re: Official juventus fc thread

i would be prepared to argue with a pretty strong case that pepe is not a better DEFENDER than lescott. and i ve phrased that carefully so as to not be ambiguous when i make my arguement

yes perhaps pepe has more recognition on the international stage' date=' being a first choice centreback for his country. but let's not forget which country he plays for... portugal, not italy, not germany, but portugal, who are hardly reknown for their defensive solidarity. i ve seen highlights of some of their games, competitive and friendly over the last few years, even with other decent defenders like bruno alves and ricardo carvalho, portugal are incredibly frail at the back. you want an example? just look at their 6-2 defeat to brazil. friendly or no friendly, pepe's performance was so bad it bouldered a comedy show

meanwhile lescott has 2 of the best centrebacks in the world ahead of him on the national stage(JT i dont actually rate as much now, i think lescott is more well rounded player than JT, faster sharper on the ground, but it seems JT's experience, strength and courage cant be dismissed easily). if any of these 2 is injuried, i fancy lescott as firm favorite as 1st choice backup. lescott at everton provided a solid foundation for moyes' not so talented side to overachieve the way he did over the last 3 seasons.

i mean last season, i watched 2 liverpool derbies within the space of a fortnight.the fa cup tie with replay. both games, lescott played exceptionally well, and i would go as far as to say he had torres in his back pocket in both games. contrast that with how pepe handled torres at anfield in the CL, to quote Jose mourinho, "it was like watching a donkey getting whipped on a beach in portugal".

now i know i should not purely judge players by their performance in a single game(because the entire madrid team was diabolical on the night). but i ve watched enough of pepe's games at the euros last year. against juventus, against liverpool to judge him. and i see a talented young defender, technically good, but is error prone, and not as commanding in the box as his physique would suggest, and does not make enough critical tackles. better than lescott? more experienced on the big stage maybe. but not an obvious "better". if you are arguing that pepe is a better footballer, maybe, but a better defender? no

but all of this is just my personal interpretation. often, i sound more sure than i actually am. but having watched plenty of lescott, and enough of pepe, i personally think i can judge them fairly. there is nothing in it tbh. i cant say one is better than the other, but i CAN say that one is probably not better than the other. if you get my gist.

[b']i write of this just to make sure people realise that i wouldnt make "ludicrous claims" if i didnt have reasons to back it up with lol. and once you read this, maybe you wont think my claims are so ludicrous.[/b]

Wow! You have essays backing you up xD

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Re: Official juventus fc thread

i would be prepared to argue with a pretty strong case that pepe is not a better defender than lescott. and i ve phrased that carefully so as to not be ambiguous when i make my arguement

yes perhaps pepe has more recognition on the international stage' date=' being a first choice centreback for his country. but let's not forget which country he plays for... portugal, not italy, not germany, but portugal, who are hardly reknown for their defensive solidarity. i ve seen highlights of some of their games, competitive and friendly over the last few years, even with other decent defenders like bruno alves and ricardo carvalho, portugal are incredibly frail at the back. you want an example? just look at their 6-2 defeat to brazil. friendly or no friendly, pepe's performance was so bad it bouldered a comedy show

meanwhile lescott has 2 of the best centrebacks in the world ahead of him on the national stage(JT i dont actually rate as much now, i think lescott is more well rounded player than JT, faster sharper on the ground, but it seems JT's experience, strength and courage cant be dismissed easily). if any of these 2 is injuried, i fancy lescott as firm favorite as 1st choice backup. lescott at everton provided a solid foundation for moyes' not so talented side to overachieve the way he did over the last 3 seasons.

i mean last season, i watched 2 liverpool derbies within the space of a fortnight.the fa cup tie with replay. both games, lescott played exceptionally well, and i would go as far as to say he had torres in his back pocket in both games. contrast that with how pepe handled torres at anfield in the CL, to quote Jose mourinho, "it was like watching a donkey getting whipped on a beach in portugal".

now i know i should not purely judge players by their performance in a single game(because the entire madrid team was diabolical on the night). but i ve watched enough of pepe's games, against roma 2 years ago, at the euros last year, against juventus and lfc this year to judge him. and i see a talented young defender, technically good, but is error prone, and not as commanding in the box as his physique would suggest, and does not make enough critical tackles. better than lescott? more experienced on the big stage maybe. but not an obvious "better". if you are arguing that pepe is a better footballer, maybe, but a better defender? no. but of course my argument is partially flawed because pepe is a lot younger than lescott and by the time he gets to lescott's age, he will certainly become a better player than lescott. but right now, if i had to pick between the 2 for a must win game, i would pick lescott

but all of this is just my personal interpretation. often, i sound more sure than i actually am. but having watched plenty of lescott, and enough of pepe, i personally think i can judge them fairly. there is nothing in it tbh. i cant say one is better than the other, but i CAN say that one is probably not better than the other. if you get my gist.

i write of this just to make sure people realise that i wouldnt make "ludicrous claims" if i didnt have reasons to back it up with lol. and once you read this, maybe you wont think my claims are so ludicrous.[/quote']

I think the pair of them are overpriced, overrated though certainly not untalented.

I see a great deal of Lescott (I watch the majority of Everton's games. "Know thine enemy" and all that :P) and he's came a great way under Moyes (who is a great manager) and not only offers solidity at the back but is the top scoring defender over the past 3 years in England. He's everything you'd want in a defender; tall but mobile, strong but level headed. His performances against Liverpool last season were incredible, as you rightly observed and he was key in helping Everton to the FA Cup final. He has had periods of indifference too though; his marvellous performances against Liverpool followed a tepid series of displays so far that season for Everton and were something of a turning point. You say he could replace Terry but when he has had his chance for England, he has been mediocre at his best but a liability at his worst. Much like you though I would expect him to be 3rd choice centre-back for England (though Capello likes to have a left footer and right footer in the middle and has given left-footed Matthew Upson a few starts).

Pepe bears some similarities to Lescott. Both are more physically adept defenders than tactically (like Carragher or Cannavaro for example). Both are able to contribute more in the attacking segment of the pitch than your average centre-back. I think Pepe is a player who could be great. Like Lescott he has all te ingredients to be a perfect centre-half but falls short. His probles are more severe than Lescott's though. Lescott may be a bit short of top quality right now and has experienced dip in form but Pepe is far more error prone and his crazy explosion of rage last year also marks him out as a liability. Your also right to note that he doesn't impose himself as well as a man of his stature and physique should.

All in all, I think neither player is a plus £20mil centre back and neither are in the top echelons of defenders but I think both have the ingredients. I think playing with a better quality of player more often will help Lescott perhaps move on and become of a higher class himself but I wonder whether he will fair as well at the less organised and more gung-ho City (though they've impressed me that they've managed to keep clean sheets in all of their games) as he did at Everton. Pepe looks as thogh he should be a great defender but I feel he lacks game intelligence (to coin a phrase used by Rafa :P) and seems to lack the intelligence to know how to apply his natural gifts. I don't want to characterise him as an oafish buffoon but sometimes you simply can't fathom how an obviously talented footballer fails so spectacularly.

Personally I think Lescott is the more solid defender and only reputation seperates them in this regard but I agree that Pepe is the more accomplished footballer.

Also, in case you wondering, Pepe is less than a year younger than Lescott.

doesnt take as long as you think' date=' 10min solid typing followed by 5mins spelling check, to me, it's all like a conversation ;)[/quote']

You spend 5 mins of a conversation spell checking! :eek::P

I'm making a ton of errors because my keyboard isn't working properly :mad:

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Re: Official juventus fc thread

Just genius. Juve got the bargain of the season for sure

Not to disturb everyones arguement about real madrid and lescott in the Juve thread but does any1 think Diego could gain 95 if his form continues to be awsum, just watched they two goals there and he is looking sensational!

wat does everyone think??

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Re: Official juventus fc thread

Not to disturb everyones arguement about real madrid and lescott in the Juve thread but does any1 think Diego could gain 95 if his form continues to be awsum' date=' just watched they two goals there and he is looking sensational!

wat does everyone think??[/quote']

I can't see why not whne you see some fo the ratings of the inter players. I said it earlier in the thread that I think come the end of the season his transfer could be recognised as world transfer of the season and although it is early days, there's no doubt he has the potential to make a big an impact as Kaka made when he first came to Serie A :)

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Re: Official juventus fc thread

Well, let me start by saying, that I've totally agree, that their prices are overrated. Although, I've didn't see Lescott too much, I've seen Pepe a lot. While he does those occasional mistakes, usually he's rock solid. I'd even go to say , that he's probably the best CB in Madrid since Hierro, whereas , I don't even think that Lescott was the best CB in Everton.

Again, I'm a bit biased, but I really believe that Pepe is the better one (not by too much, though). If only Pepe could improve his self-control...

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Re: Official juventus fc thread

Juventus for the Seria A? Not in my opinion. They just seem to lack something' date=' probably in a serious young quick forward like Eto'o although not young he is still the best striker in the world.[/quote']

to be fair iaquinta is deceptively fast, and etoo is almost 30.

i dont fancy juventus' chances for the title not because i dont think we are good enough but because inter is so ridiculously strong. plus they have players who have won the league so many times, while our team is still relatively young and inconsistent. but on 1 off games we can beat anyone. which is why i have a sneaky feeling that this might be our year in the CL. noone fancies us, but pundits in italy all look at us and say, we are serious dark horses, and most of our fans secretly fancy our chances for the big one;)

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Re: Official juventus fc thread

to be fair iaquinta is deceptively fast' date=' and etoo is almost 30.

i dont fancy juventus' chances for the title not because i dont think we are good enough but because inter is so ridiculously strong. plus they have players who have won the league so many times, while our team is still relatively young and inconsistent. but on 1 off games we can beat anyone. which is why i have a sneaky feeling that this might be our year in the CL. noone fancies us, but pundits in italy all look at us and say, we are serious dark horses, and most of our fans secretly fancy our chances for the big one;)[/quote']

Ya Maybe in the Champions League all right but as you said they are incosistent and Iaquinta is quick but is not regarded in the world as a top class striker.

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