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PORTUGAL – 1st and 2nd Division extensive thread - Discussion Thread


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Re: PORTUGAL – 1st and 2nd Division extensive thread - Discussion Thread

Hey DP' date=' can I have a quick onpinion on Nuno Coelho please? Keep or sell?[/quote']

From Academica? Keep him. He might join Benfica. If it's the one from Sporting, keep him as well.

Falcao left it late didnt he lol ' date=' nice little hatrick.[/quote']

Great performance in horrible pitch and weather conditions. Falcao and Porto FTW. :)

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Re: PORTUGAL – 1st and 2nd Division extensive thread - Discussion Thread It has been a great journey since 2011, great people and great fun! And well, This is my forum post number 1000! I could

Re: PORTUGAL – 1st and 2nd Division extensive thread - Discussion Thread

I would love to see André Villas-Boas as the new Porto coach (just like you said).

7 months later' date=' Villas Boas has made Porto into a force to be reckon. DP, you are aware of how I think about Porto, but still, how embarrasing it may sound, I just can't look over the fact how strong Porto's been and how vital Villas Boas. Under Villas Boas', guidance, Porto have now set a club record with most games unbeaten. Guess who he beat? Mourinho. Villas Boas certainly has been showing manager promises, both last year at Academica and this year at Porto. Right now, he fully justifies the nickname ''The next one''.

Sporting, the team that he was most heavily linked with before he chose Porto, has had their up's and down's this season. Frankly, Paulo Sergio's use of many different systems has been having an effect on the Sporting players. Paulo Sergio tends to shift formation from everything between 4-4-2 (diamond version) to 4-3-3. To be honest, I'd rather see him sticking to one formation. I understand that he needed to use various formations during his start at Sporting beacuse he had so many new players he never previously had been managing, but he should have been stucked to one formation right after the pre-season, as it is under the pre-season you should ''experiment''. Valdes has been excellent when played in the middle, but still, Sergio uses him at the left-flank at occasions (like against Vitoria just days ago) where he wasn't so impressing during the start of the season, when Sergio still was experimenting with the formations and the players. Sergio also doesn't take use of the creativity and flow Soares and Salomao has in their games. Sure, Salomao has done some poor performances this season, but he has been enjoying more good ones that poor ones. Frankly, it doesn't matter if he's done some poor performances, as he is young and developing. Every player started out like this.

As Salomao ain't playing so much, Mati beeing injured and most of the times beeing injuried and Valdes sometimes playes as more central, where he shouldn't be playing, Sporting doesn't have any creativity in their game. Especially during the beginning under Sergio's era, this was the case, as he still was experimenting with the tactics. I'd llike to quote the post I made on the PTS thread of Salomao's;

When Sporting doesn't play a 4-4-2 (diamond style) and thus, losing Mati's creativeiness as he is putting out wide which isn't he prefered position, their man focus is to attack through the wings. Valdes has got 1 or 2 many chances, like you said, and it's ridicolous to see a promising and creative player like Salomao, who could that ''extra thing'', on the bench. Valdes ain't aswell a player with creativity and he is definately in-form. This lack of creativity has lead to Sporting dropping far to many points in the league, as the more ''beatable teams'' puts 10 men behind the ball in order to snatch a draw or in the best case, get full 3 points. If Sporting would put Mati in the AM position and Salomao on a wing they would have creativeness from 2 players and at the same time and then would could perhaps see some changes.
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Re: PORTUGAL – 1st and 2nd Division extensive thread - Discussion Thread

7 months later' date=' Villas Boas has made Porto into a force to be reckon. DP, you are aware of how I think about Porto, but still, how embarrasing it may sound, I just can't look over the fact how strong Porto's been and how vital Villas Boas. Under Villas Boas', guidance, Porto have now set a club record with most games unbeaten. Guess who he beat? Mourinho. Villas Boas certainly has been showing manager promises, both last year at Academica and this year at Porto. Right now, he fully justifies the nickname ''The next one''.[/quote']

Yes, I'd say most of the credit has to go to Villas-Boas. The team hasn't changed much in terms of roster, in fact only the likes of Moutinho and Maicon/Otamendi are new to the starting XI, but the difference to the football we played with Jesualdo is abysmal. We finally abandoned the quick transitions style (not to be mistaken with counter-attack) and embraced the football of possession. Moutinho is the key for this to work, he really filled the void left by Lucho Gonzalez.

Sporting, the team that he was most heavily linked with before he chose Porto, has had their up's and down's this season. Frankly, Paulo Sergio's use of many different systems has been having an effect on the Sporting players. Paulo Sergio tends to shift formation from everything between 4-4-2 (diamond version) to 4-3-3. To be honest, I'd rather see him sticking to one formation. I understand that he needed to use various formations during his start at Sporting beacuse he had so many new players he never previously had been managing, but he should have been stucked to one formation right after the pre-season, as it is under the pre-season you should ''experiment''. Valdes has been excellent when played in the middle, but still, Sergio uses him at the left-flank at occasions (like against Vitoria just days ago) where he wasn't so impressing during the start of the season, when Sergio still was experimenting with the formations and the players. Sergio also doesn't take use of the creativity and flow Soares and Salomao has in their games. Sure, Salomao has done some poor performances this season, but he has been enjoying more good ones that poor ones. Frankly, it doesn't matter if he's done some poor performances, as he is young and developing. Every player started out like this.

I don't think Paulo Sérgio has what it takes to manage a big club. I surely wouldn't include him in my Top 5 managers of the Portuguese League. He's average at best. He can't seem to stick to a reasonable tactical choice, and I can't see him as the motivating type of manager. I mean, what has he done so far? Sporting's chances to win the Portuguese League are as big as Liverpool's to win the EPL; they're out of the Portuguese Cup; they're soon to be out of Europa League, and I reckon they'll finish this season exactly like they did in the last one: 'zero titoli'. Honestly I think that Sporting has got a squad good enough to achieve a bit more. And to think that Villas-Boas was two steps close to sign with them... We can thank them, just like we did with Quaresma, Varela and Moutinho. :rolleyes:

Regarding Salomão, he's being underused. Just like Matias (although he's been injured), Vuk or Djaló. What's the point of having manpower if you don't use it effectively? Sporting needs a foreign manager ASAP. One that has little knowledge on Portuguese football. That's the only way they'll get to fully unleash the true potential of the squad, instead of committing the same mistakes again and again.

Hi' date=' great thread,

Would love to tap into your expertise:

Bruno Gama

Tiago Targino

Any potential or time to sell them?[/quote']

Sell Bruno Gama, keep Targino.

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Re: PORTUGAL – 1st and 2nd Division extensive thread - Discussion Thread

Sporting needs a foreign manager ASAP.

Good point!

I'd love to see a South-American manager (Brazilian manager would be the best option' date=' in my opinion. The culture and the language wouldn't be much of a difference at all) or a Spanish manager. Someone who actually dares of taking use of the offensive weapons Sporting [i']actually[/i] posseses. Whenever the big three plays faces (the majority) of the teams in Liga Sagres, those teams they faces are backing down with all the players behind the ball. If Sporting would take a manager who actually isn't afraid of using the best weapon Sporting has (the attack), I'm sure Sporting would perform a whole lot better. The manager would take use of the creativity players such as Valdes, Mati and Salomao brings to the squad. We wouldn't be seeing a 4-4-2 (diamond style with DM's such as Andre Santos and Maniche on the flanks) and instead, the manager might opt for a 4-2-3-1 with Mati/Valdes in the middle and Salomao and Yannick on the flanks. It may be a bit offensive, but I'm sure it'd be safe against every team in Portugal bar perhaps Porto, Benfica and maybe Braga. With this formation, the creativity Mati and Valdes posseses would be used and not get wasted as it gets when they are playing on the flanks, which has been the case under Paulo Sergio. Yannick, who can be great at periods and stinking at others, would not let his talent get wasted. Even though he has his up's and down's, he has a great potential in him. Hopefully, some Sporting manager will finally trust in his talent. Salomao, as we discussed, should be getting a lot more opportunities. This guy got's so MUCH talent.

In this way, the attack would be used so much more to lock up the men-behind-ball-method practically every team in Portugal uses. If Sporting would go with this, the defence wouldn't be tested so much aswell. The lesser the defence gets tested, the lesser the opportunites are for them to commit any kind of personal mistake that only can happen to Sporting.

Btw, Benfica signed Nolito. 24 years old and still stuck at La Masia, but he has showed promise there. Hopefully it turns out to be a good signing. However, once again the Benfica board is acting stupid. After paying 8.5M € for the 3rd goalkeeper of Atletico Madrid (although he showed real promise under his 6 months long loan at Zaragoza) and paying Atletico Madrid 3M € for a season long loan of Salvio (with no buy-out clause or anything in-baked in it), Benfica has offered a 900.000 € contract for a player with no routine at all from La Liga (Nolito).

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Re: PORTUGAL – 1st and 2nd Division extensive thread - Discussion Thread

Talking about gret goals this week in Portugal, check this one out:

5SFeY188hpY

This guy is Diogo Salomao who plays for Sporting CP. He's 22 years old and has just signed a new contract with the club.

He's very promissing and SM rates him at just 80, so get him asap ;)

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Re: PORTUGAL – 1st and 2nd Division extensive thread - Discussion Thread

Talking about gret goals this week in Portugal' date=' check this one out:

[youtube']5SFeY188hpY

This guy is Diogo Salomao who plays for Sporting CP. He's 22 years old and has just signed a new contract with the club.

He's very promissing and SM rates him at just 80, so get him asap ;)

That goal is nuts! In a (very) good way.

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Re: PORTUGAL – 1st and 2nd Division extensive thread - Discussion Thread

Abdoulaye Ba, 20 years old, centre back. Porto player, loaned out to Covilha.

Could you please tell me, if you know, more about this player? I can't watch Portugal's 2nd division, so i don't know what kind of player is.

Is he doing well at Covilha? What's his potential? Can he make it and become a Porto squad member for the new season, when his loan spell ends? Or will he be sold or loaned out again?

I know it's too early for new season, but i'd like to know as much as i can for this player, especially about his potential, because i have the chance to sign him in a competitive GW.

Thanks.

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Re: PORTUGAL – 1st and 2nd Division extensive thread - Discussion Thread

Abdoulaye Ba' date=' 20 years old, centre back. Porto player, loaned out to Covilha.

Could you please tell me, if you know, more about this player? I can't watch Portugal's 2nd division, so i don't know what kind of player is.

Is he doing well at Covilha? What's his potential? Can he make it and become a Porto squad member for the new season, when his loan spell ends? Or will he be sold or loaned out again?

I know it's too early for new season, but i'd like to know as much as i can for this player, especially about his potential, because i have the chance to sign him in a competitive GW.

Thanks.[/quote']

He is physically a beast, very tall and very strong. But that's basically just it. He isn't particularly fast and he gets beaten through the ground easily. He was amazing in our youth setup, but when things got rough and he started to play against more experienced and talented players... Well, he may be worth to buy at a reasonable price, but you'll probably have to wait a long time before you get any return on the investment.

I remember Derby saying Benfica will buy someone to replace Luiz instead of using Sidnei..

Think this guy will be replacing Luiz when he switches clubs?

Let's see how he adapts first. Jardel was having a very nice season with Olhanense, but representing a mid-table club is quite different from representing a title challenger. He won't have much room to play for now, but yes, he could be a long term replacement for David Luiz.

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Re: PORTUGAL – 1st and 2nd Division extensive thread - Discussion Thread

He is physically a beast' date=' very tall and very strong. But that's basically just it. He isn't particularly fast and he gets beaten through the ground easily. He was amazing in our youth setup, but when things got rough and he started to play against more experienced and talented players... Well, he may be worth to buy at a reasonable price, but you'll probably have to wait a long time before you get any return on the investment.[/quote']

Ok, thanks! :)

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Re: PORTUGAL – 1st and 2nd Division extensive thread - Discussion Thread

Sporting losing is no big shock especially when you have Rui Patrico in goal. :P

Rui Patricio is the least of Sporting's problems. Actually I think he has been performing quite well.

Also, I think that Radebe was referring to the fact that Sporting's chairman resigned, and not exactly to the loss against Paços de Ferreira.

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Re: PORTUGAL – 1st and 2nd Division extensive thread - Discussion Thread

Rui Patricio is the least of Sporting's problems. Actually I think he has been performing quite well.

As we and DP have discussed' date=' Paulo Sergio, the Sporting coach, isn't really the man for Sporting. His massive re-vamp for practically every game when it comes to the tactical area is really not good for the players. How many different formations have Sporting used this season? Four, five...?

Also, I think that Radebe was referring to the fact that Sporting's chairman resigned, and not exactly to the loss against Paços de Ferreira.

I really don't know what's strucked through his mind for the last two years or so. Bad transfering, bad decisions when it comes to appointing managers and most notably, bad media-handeling. It's not to often you hear about Sporting in a negative out in the media. I mean, just take the Moutinho-situation for instance - There was an argument between Moutinho, Bettencourt and Paulo Sergio (I think). Moutinho gets frustrated and is not allowed to train with the rest of the squad. Moutinho is then smart enough to ask for a move. Paulo Sergio, who is a charesmatic manager, is like most of the managers in the wide world and doesn't care if the best player in his squad leaves, as Moutinho, in his eyes, is a finished chapter beacuse they had a bad relation right from the start. Bettencourt then have to do the unthinkable and sell Moutinho to their perhaps fierest rival, as it would only hurt his image and respect if he decided to go against the manager and fire him just after some time after the appointment. Moutinho, against the fans grudge, gets sold to Porto. Even that was a bad deal, in my opinion. The media, as always gets information about it, and we then have a major coup, which was the upcome to all this. I mean, if the media didn't get any sneeze about this, then I do not think Moutinho last days at Sporting would get blowned up so big.

Not trying to snatch Villa-Boas on a contract before the end of the last season also just shows how bad Bettencourt ended his reign at Sporting. I mean, we all knew Porto would get rid of Jesualdo Ferreira after the poor season Porto had, so before Porto would contact Villas-Boas, Sporting could have done so, no? We all know Porto is a bigger club than Sporting and we all know Porto is in a better financial situation and could therefore offer a better contract to Villas-Boas, so if Sporting and Bettencourt would be smart enough, they should have tried to approach Villas-Boas before the season ended. However, the Sporting board and Bettencourt just doesn't bother enough and instead takes on Paulo Sergio, who we all know prefers to change tactics after having a look on the opposite team. That is just like commiting suicide in todays modern football (if you are a big team, that is), I reckon.

As I said above, changing tactics for utilizing the other team when your team is one of the bigger teams in the league, is the first thing you learn that you shouldn't do in the manager school. We all know that at least 80% of the teams in the Liga Sagres are backing home with 10 men behind their own half in order to secure at draw against the big three (and Braga). Why change your style of tactic for each game when you, as a big team in a league with lower opposite teams, faces the same kind of football every game? Anyway, I'm not here to discuss about Sporting's so called ''manager'', Paulo Sergio. However, Paulo Sergio approached the same style of management at Vitoria Guimarães, so it was a bad decision by Bettencourt (and the rest of the Sporting board) to take him to Sporting.

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Re: PORTUGAL – 1st and 2nd Division extensive thread - Discussion Thread

As we and DP have discussed' date=' Paulo Sergio, the Sporting coach, isn't really the man for Sporting. His massive re-vamp for practically every game when it comes to the tactical area is really not good for the players. How many different formations have Sporting used this season? Four, five...?[/quote']

Five, if I'm not mistaken. Let's see... He has tried to play Liedson alone up front; then he tried to partner him with Saleiro/Djaló; he played Valdés as a winger a lot of times before eventually realizing he played much better as an AM (duh); Vukcevic has played at least on three different positions this season (second striker, winger and AM); when he needs an extra winger, he gives a chance to Salomão, who should be a freakin' starter since the beginning of the season... Oh, not to mention using João Pereira as an RM while Abel gets the RB spot. André Santos has had his fair share of inventions as well. Did I forget something Pazz? Talk about tactical inconsistency...

I really don't know what's strucked through his mind for the last two years or so. Bad transfering, bad decisions when it comes to appointing managers and most notably, bad media-handeling. It's not to often you hear about Sporting in a negative out in the media. I mean, just take the Moutinho-situation for instance - There was an argument between Moutinho, Bettencourt and Paulo Sergio (I think). Moutinho gets frustrated and is not allowed to train with the rest of the squad. Moutinho is then smart enough to ask for a move. Paulo Sergio, who is a charesmatic manager, is like most of the managers in the wide world and doesn't care if the best player in his squad leaves, as Moutinho, in his eyes, is a finished chapter beacuse they had a bad relation right from the start. Bettencourt then have to do the unthinkable and sell Moutinho to their perhaps fierest rival, as it would only hurt his image and respect if he decided to go against the manager and fire him just after some time after the appointment. Moutinho, against the fans grudge, gets sold to Porto. Even that was a bad deal, in my opinion. The media, as always gets information about it, and we then have a major coup, which was the upcome to all this. I mean, if the media didn't get any sneeze about this, then I do not think Moutinho last days at Sporting would get blowned up so big.

There's a lot to uncover related to Moutinho's transfer... Most of it is speculation though, but I'd say it wasn't really Bettencourt's fault here. It was either sell Moutinho to whoever was willing to pay double digits (only Porto appeared to be interested), or having to sustain him until the end of the season outside of the main squad. Sporting is in no position to take the upper hand on financial issues, and they wouldn't afford to have such an heavy asset simply training on his own. Bettencourt did a lot of mistakes during his reign (from Paulo Sérgio to Pongolle), but Moutinho's case was a dead-end from the beginning.

Not trying to snatch Villa-Boas on a contract before the end of the last season also just shows how bad Bettencourt ended his reign at Sporting. I mean, we all knew Porto would get rid of Jesualdo Ferreira after the poor season Porto had, so before Porto would contact Villas-Boas, Sporting could have done so, no? We all know Porto is a bigger club than Sporting and we all know Porto is in a better financial situation and could therefore offer a better contract to Villas-Boas, so if Sporting and Bettencourt would be smart enough, they should have tried to approach Villas-Boas before the season ended.

Oh he did Pazz, he did. In fact, Villas-Boas had a pre-contract signed with Sporting. It was all over the news last year. But we have to credit our chairman on this one, he was the reason that caused the rupture on said pre-contract. If Porto hadn't interfered, Villas-Boas would be in Paulo Sergio's place at the moment.

In the end, we played with our bigger stature, our better financial status and with Vilas-Boas' own love for Porto to seduce him. It was risky, he had almost no managerial experience. Fortunately it paid off...

As I said above, changing tactics for utilizing the other team when your team is one of the bigger teams in the league, is the first thing you learn that you shouldn't do in the manager school. We all know that at least 80% of the teams in the Liga Sagres are backing home with 10 men behind their own half in order to secure at draw against the big three (and Braga). Why change your style of tactic for each game when you, as a big team in a league with lower opposite teams, faces the same kind of football every game? Anyway, I'm not here to discuss about Sporting's so called ''manager'', Paulo Sergio. However, Paulo Sergio approached the same style of management at Vitoria Guimarães, so it was a bad decision by Bettencourt (and the rest of the Sporting board) to take him to Sporting.

Well, I have to say that Sporting's squad isn't very good... It might be enough to do better than the current results, but after all they did lose their three best players (Moutinho, Veloso and Izmailov, who probably needs a bionic knee by now).

Bottom line: the weaker clubs which play with an ultra defensive mentality against the "big three" narrowed it down to Porto and Benfica. They don't play as defensively against Sporting any more. Just watch last night's match. I saw a second half which was practically dominated by Paços. And they were playing away. When Sporting scored the equalizer on the counter, it was predictable that Paços started to operated more on their midfield, trying to keep possession and waste time. Instead, Paços' manager sends Nelson Oliveira (A STRIKER) to the pitch, and they score the third and last goal of the match. My point is that these clubs know that Sporting is fragile, and they are not afraid to have a go at them now. And Sporting hasn't been able to cope with it yet. It's good for the Portuguese football. But not as good for Sporting. Paulo Sérgio's fault? Meh, probably...

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Re: PORTUGAL – 1st and 2nd Division extensive thread - Discussion Thread

derby

What do you think of two players that were on loan to olhanese last season Franco vincius and nivaldo jardel both secureing moves to braga and benfica respectively. Im not asking what rating they will be but how good are they and do they have enough potential to do well at the respective clubs . :)

Thanks :)

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Re: PORTUGAL – 1st and 2nd Division extensive thread - Discussion Thread

derby

What do you think of two players that were on loan to olhanese last season Franco vincius and nivaldo jardel both secureing moves to braga and benfica respectively. Im not asking what rating they will be but how good are they and do they have enough potential to do well at the respective clubs . :)

Thanks :)

I really rate Vinicius, he reminds me of Essien. He should do well in Braga, specially considering that Vandinho has seen better days and it won't take long before he retires.

Jardel is a prospective defender and he was probably one of the best CB playing outside the big three. Don't expect him to play much in Benfica though, he won't stand a chance with Luisão and David Luiz in front of him. Maybe next season we'll see more of him.

Anyway, I'd say that both of them are in for a decent rise and they would be good purchases in a competitive GW.

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Re: PORTUGAL – 1st and 2nd Division extensive thread - Discussion Thread

I really rate Vinicius' date=' he reminds me of Essien. He should do well in Braga, specially considering that Vandinho has seen better days and it won't take long before he retires.

Jardel is a prospective defender and he was probably one of the best CB playing outside the big three. Don't expect him to play much in Benfica though, he won't stand a chance with Luisão and David Luiz in front of him. Maybe next season we'll see more of him.

Anyway, I'd say that both of them are in for a decent rise and they would be good purchases in a competitive GW.[/quote']

Thanks I brought the both of them in EC 5579 before there rises as I knew they have good potential but need some EXPERT opinion . Thanks for taking time out to write mate

I shall rep you for your trouble :)

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