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Best Manager in the World


Kieran Smith
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Best Manager in the World  

  1. 1.

    • Sir Alex Ferguson
      17
    • Arsene Wenger
      6
    • Guus Hiddink
      3
    • Josep Guardiola
      6
    • Fabio Cappello
      5
    • Sir Neller
      6
    • Other
      8


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Re: Best Manager in the World

Well it definitely isn't Guardiola...

Fergie has done brilliantly, don't get me wrong, but I wouldn't pick him. His CV isn't complete. Besides some early success in Scotland with Aberdeen and St. Mirren (which is also impressive), his main achievement is just building Manchester United up, which admittedly, he has done magnificently, unbelievably well. A worthy winner if he does win this poll.

Personally, I think I'd go for Marcello Lippi since he experienced massive success with Juve, Decent success wth Napoli before them and of course won the World Cup.

Cappello could well overtake him if he does something with England...

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Re: Best Manager in the World

Ottmar Hitzfeld always deserves a mention in these threads. His record speaks for itself really:

3 Swiss Cups (With FC Aarau in 1985; with Grasshopper Club Zürich in 1989 and 1990)

2 Swiss Super League (With Grasshopper Club Zürich in 1990 and 1991)

7 German championships (With Borussia Dortmund in 1995 and 1996; with FC Bayern Munich in 1999, 2000, 2001, 2003 and 2008)

3 German Cups (With FC Bayern Munich in 2000, 2003 and 2008)

2 UEFA Champions League (With Borussia Dortmund in 1997; with FC Bayern Munich in 2001)

2 Intercontinental Cup (With Borussia Dortmund in 1997 and FC Bayern Munich in 2001)

2 World Coach of the Year (1997 and 2001)

Voted Bayern Munich's greatest coach ever

Rated the best Bundesliga-coach of all time

Plus, he's now doing well coaching Switzerland in the WC2010 qualifiers (although admittedly they are in a relatively weak group).

Is he the best? I'd say it's a toss up between him and Lippi, with Capello just behind. Fergie, Wenger and Hiddink would be in the next group.

Guardiola has a lot of work to do before he deserves to be anywhere near the list. Getting lucky and inheriting the best collection of players in world football doesn't make him one of the greats... I mean it says it all when he's sitting there in his office, watching the 2nd best team in the league spend a quarter of a BILLION on new players... only to STILL be the 2nd best team in the league afterwards. :P

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Re: Best Manager in the World

Ottmar Hitzfeld always deserves a mention in these threads. His record speaks for itself really:

3 Swiss Cups (With FC Aarau in 1985; with Grasshopper Club Zürich in 1989 and 1990)

2 Swiss Super League (With Grasshopper Club Zürich in 1990 and 1991)

7 German championships (With Borussia Dortmund in 1995 and 1996; with FC Bayern Munich in 1999' date=' 2000, 2001, 2003 and 2008)

3 German Cups (With FC Bayern Munich in 2000, 2003 and 2008)

2 UEFA Champions League (With Borussia Dortmund in 1997; with FC Bayern Munich in 2001)

2 Intercontinental Cup (With Borussia Dortmund in 1997 and FC Bayern Munich in 2001)

2 World Coach of the Year (1997 and 2001)

Voted Bayern Munich's greatest coach ever

Rated the best Bundesliga-coach of all time

Plus, he's now doing well coaching Switzerland in the WC2010 qualifiers (although admittedly they are in a relatively weak group).

Is he the best? I'd say it's a toss up between him and Lippi, with Capello just behind. Fergie, Wenger and Hiddink would be in the next group.

Guardiola has a lot of work to do before he deserves to be anywhere near the list. Getting lucky and inheriting the best collection of players in world football doesn't make him one of the greats... I mean it says it all when he's sitting there in his office, watching the 2nd best team in the league spend a quarter of a BILLION on new players... only to STILL be the 2nd best team in the league afterwards. :P[/quote']

I was going to mention Hittzfeld myself but I didn't realise he'd branched out internationally...impressive.

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Re: Best Manager in the World

I think you can seperate the managers into a number of categories, but to rank them definitively might be a little difficult, if not a bit disrespectful to some. i mean how do you compare lippi with ferguson when one is a world cup winner. and how do you compare aragones with mourinho when one is 70 and the other 40 something. I think it is very hard to get a compromise of ability age and record. that's why i will categorise them

category A: the half coach half legend category. these are undisputed "world class" managers whoes decisions are never questions. they managers whoes record alone justify their reputation. in no particular order:

lippi, ferguson, hiddink trappatoni, hitzfield, capello, aragones

category B. these guys are not in category A for one of 2 reasons, or maybe both: 1)not old enough 2)not enough trophies. But, unless something very wrong happens, they will all be in category A within 10 years

wenger, ancelotti, mourinho, del bosque, rehhagel(somewhere between category A and B), scolari, van gaal, benitez

Category C. the too young/too old/too south American/too little top level experience/too much underachievers category

Guardiola, moyes, o’neil, spalletti, rednapp, prandelli, delio rossi, gasperini, pellegrini, ranieri, bielsa, mancini, jesualdo ferreira, le guen, rijkaard.

Category D: the managers with funny nicknames but not so sure where they belong category

“big sam”, “sparky”, “psycho”, carlos “only good as assistant” queiroz, and of course, ol’ keano

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Re: Best Manager in the World

ferguson's tactical ability is actually quite suspect. i always felt that had ferguson been more tactically competent, united would have won far more european trophies. if you want master tacticians, look no further than the italian german dutch groups, and of course old rafa, who copies them

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Re: Best Manager in the World

ferguson's tactical ability is actually quite suspect. i always felt that had ferguson been more tactically competent' date=' united would have won far more european trophies. if you want master tacticians, look no further than the italian german dutch groups, and of course old rafa, who copies them[/quote']

I think he's actually come out and said himself that it took him some time to adapt to managing in Europe and how different it is to the Premier League. Domestically he's great tactically, and reaching 2 european finals consecutively surely suggests he's not too bad in the Champions League either? You don't win what he has won by being "quite suspect" tactically, surely?

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Re: Best Manager in the World

I think he's actually come out and said himself that it took him some time to adapt to managing in Europe and how different it is to the Premier League. Domestically he's great tactically' date=' and reaching 2 european finals consecutively surely suggests he's not too bad in the Champions League either? You don't win what he has won by being "quite suspect" tactically, surely?[/quote']

well the thing about ferguson is he adapted well. But it certainly took him a very long time. i think united's CL victory in 2008 was a his best tactical/technical performance from a coach's point of view. But then, against barca this year, you saw what happened. people say united were outplayed, but i felt it was mostly down to the fact that guardiola tactically outmanoevred ferguson. rooney and park out on the wings were used to cover the flanks defensively. But when barca continuely to attack through the middle, pulling messi inside, thus outnumbering united in midfield, ferguson never adjusted to counter that. and when he did make the change, tevez on for anderson, it was clearly the wrong move. Because the biggest problem was giggs being wasted in the withdrawn forward role, where he kepted getting bypassed by the barca midfield. he should have taken off giggs earlier, push park into the middle to add some energy, and put tevez into the wide role. with hindsight, easy for me to say, but ferguson should have seen it with his experience

not ferguson's finest performance

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Re: Best Manager in the World

I think he's actually come out and said himself that it took him some time to adapt to managing in Europe and how different it is to the Premier League. Domestically he's great tactically' date=' and reaching 2 european finals consecutively surely suggests he's not too bad in the Champions League either? You don't win what he has won by being "quite suspect" tactically, surely?[/quote']

I don't know, he isn't terribly tactically but his skills lie elsewhere I feel. I think his success lies more in his ability to build good teams and his motivational talents. I think most would agree that Benitez is the more talented manager tactically but not over all.

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Re: Best Manager in the World

well the thing about ferguson is he adapted well. But it certainly took him a very long time. i think united's CL victory in 2008 was a his best tactical/technical performance from a coach's point of view. But then' date=' against barca this year, you saw what happened. people say united were outplayed, but i felt it was mostly down to the fact that guardiola tactically outmanoevred ferguson. rooney and park out on the wings were used to cover the flanks defensively. But when barca continuely to attack through the middle, pulling messi inside, thus outnumbering united in midfield, ferguson never adjusted to counter that. and when he did make the change, tevez on for anderson, it was clearly the wrong move. Because the biggest problem was giggs being wasted in the withdrawn forward role, where he kepted getting bypassed by the barca midfield

not ferguson's finest performance[/quote']

Fair point, but that's just one game out of the thousands he has managed in his career. I actually think too much of the blame has been pinned onn SAF for that game, but that debate's for another thread. As I said in the previous post, I dont think its fair to say he's suspect tactically, even if he did make mistakes in that one final.

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Re: Best Manager in the World

Fair point' date=' but that's just one game out of the thousands he has managed in his career. I actually think too much of the blame has been pinned onn SAF for that game, but that debate's for another thread. As I said in the previous post, I dont think its fair to say he's suspect tactically, even if he did make mistakes in that one final.[/quote']

I think generally speaking he is a decent tactician but if you compare him to the top European guys that Liucci has put in his category A, do you really think Ferguson compares to them, simply in a tactical sense?

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Re: Best Manager in the World

I don't know' date=' he isn't terribly tactically but his skills lie elsewhere I feel. I think his success lies more in his ability to build good teams and his motivational talents. I think most would agree that Benitez is the more talented manager tactically but not over all.[/quote']

I think Rafa's great in Europe, but in the Premier League I don't think he's at the same level, particularly near the beginning of his time at Liverpool. He did well last season but the seasons before that he didn't often pick a settled side, constantly swapping and changing and didn't do too well in the league. I take your point though and I do think he's got used to the English league now, and I do agree with you when you sai his better skills are in other areas. Still, you dont win all those trophies by not being good tactically.

I think generally speaking he is a decent tactician but if you compare him to the top European guys that Liucci has put in his category A' date=' do you really think Ferguson compares to them, simply in a tactical sense?[/quote']

Yeah I agree with you, I wasnt trying to say he was a fantastic tactician, I was just saying he can't be that bad given everything he has done.

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Re: Best Manager in the World

I retract my previous statement! :P

But seriously, the greatest ever manager has to be Vittorio pozzo, Italy manager who lifted 2 consecutive world cups in 1934 and 1938 (the only manager to ever win 2 world cups, never mind successfully I believe), and not to mention he discovered Guiseppe Meazza, Italy's greatest ever player by a mile.

Innovated the game tactically, by inventing the uber-attack minded 'Metodo' formatiopn, the first ever 2-5-3 system implemented with 2 sweepers.

Those who say Guardiola are idiots. I daresay that even ol' bleedin' Joe Kinnear could have won at least 2 trophies with the squad at his disposal, I mean you talk about having it easy... :rolleyes:

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Re: Best Manager in the World

I retract my previous statement! :P

But seriously' date=' the greatest ever manager has to be Vittorio pozzo, [b']Italy manager who lifted 2 consecutive world cups in 1934 and 1938[/b] (the only manager to ever win 2 world cups, never mind successfully I believe), and not to mention he discovered Guiseppe Meazza, Italy's greatest ever player by a mile.

Innovated the game tactically, by inventing the uber-attack minded 'Metodo' formatiopn, the first ever 2-5-3 system implemented with 2 sweepers.

Those who say Guardiola are idiots. I daresay that even ol' bleedin' Joe Kinnear could have won at least 2 trophies with the squad at his disposal, I mean you talk about having it easy... :rolleyes:

Give me a break dude, there were like 6 countries participating in those days .... it was the time of the "Great Depression" (no that does not mean everyone was sad and popping prozac like they were mentos :P:D) so I would hardly call it tough competition. There was no qualifying, anyone who showed up was in the cup and in with a chance so don't be throwing rocks when you're in a glass house my friend! ;)

Herby

edit: 1934 was the first WC where you had to qualify. Apologies. But come on, Austria came 4th ...

1930 was the farcial one which Uruwho won. lol

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Re: Best Manager in the World

Give me a break dude' date=' there were like 6 countries participating in those days .... it was the time of the "Great Depression" (no that does not mean everyone was sad and popping prozac like they were mentos :P:D) so I would hardly call it tough competition. There was no qualifying, anyone who showed up was in the cup and in with a chance so don't be throwing rocks when you're in a glass house my friend! ;)

Herby[/quote']

:o Whoops - eeh - diddles! :P But until a manager wins 2 successive WCs, it's Pozzo for the win! :D

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Re: Best Manager in the World

When I said ferguson is not as tactically savy, it was suppose to be a relative comment. I meant that he is not as tactically savy as most other top coaches around the world. When we look at ferguson’s tactical history, we really have to look at the whole picture. Ferguson has been at united for 20 odd years, and at least 15 of those seasons they have played CL football. The 2 CL victories may seem hugely impressive by their own right, but actually, the record is 2 victories in 15 attempts. No other contemporary manager in modern day football enjoys the kind of comfort and security that united bestows on Ferguson. You can argue that his domestic record keeps him in the job, because with that European record alone, he certainly would not have lasted so long at united lol

I think right up till 2007, ferguson has remained fairly naïve in terms of his tactical approach in Europe. Up till then, he always maintained his open attacking football that is often ineffective in the cagey tactical European encounters. And it is no surprise that up to that point, he only won 1 European cup in something like 13 attempts. Even then, that particular victory came in the most fortuitous circumstances. They were outplayed and outthought by a Bayern side, who hit bar and post. God denied them that day

After 2007, ferguson’s tactical approach in Europe became different. He started playing a water tight 433 with men behind the ball, that deployed ronaldo as the free role forward who was allow to break at will. Many people actually suggested that it was queiroz who suggested this approach. I personally think it was down to the 3-0 defeat against Milan the previous year, which made him seriously rethink his approach. I suppose ferguson’s approaches since then certainly earns his some tactical credit, but it is pretty clear that that particular strategy was his only tactical weapon. The moment barca scored in the CL final, ferguson made one tactical mistake after another. And in italy there is a football saying “everyone knows how to play defensive when they are winning, but the really good coaches know how to turn defeat into a win”. Well ferguson did that plenty of times, but more by his motivational methods than his tactical approach.

Let s make things clear here, im not saying ferguson is some kind of idiot. Lol. Im just saying the tactical aspect of his management is not as good as a lot of other European coaches. He is not really a technical coach. He is more of a motivational inspirations type of manager.

In italy tactics are schooled into coaches at an early age. Lippi was 45 when he took juventus to 3 CL finals in the first 4 years of his stint at juventus. That is what I meant by pure tactical ability. Because in italy, coaches learn about tactics by operating in domestic football alone. In England however, until recently, tactics has been a fairly new thing. And the only way guys like ferguson could hone his tactical ability is by playing in Europe. Unfortunately for him and united, they have often had to learn tactics the hard way. But certainly, finally at the age of 70, after 20 years of European football, ferguson has finally learnt how to win Europe(or rather, doing it convincing). Still, he is by no means a natural in the tactical/technical compartment.

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