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Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)


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Guest ExiledScotInTheUSA

Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

That was a post by someone who is very naive....before you start accusing do some historical research and you will see there is plenty of evidence that Jesus exists. Christian and Non-Christian historian agree with that.

Secondly after he was raised to life about 100 people who weren't followers who had seen him before and they claimed after. This wasn't a group of people who came together and thought that but people all over the countryside. You can't tell me 100 people had the same hallucination. Mind you with keeping with the quality of the other arguments you probably will...:rolleyes:

Ok, show me the proof that Jesus existed, ( my turn to roll eyes) :rolleyes:. And I don't mean heresay, show me one document or writing from this time in history? He is not mentioned in ANY Roman literature of that time, there is no mention of him in any Jewish chronicles and the Jews were famous for their documentation of history. Josephus, the main Jewish writer around the time of the alleged Jesus, makes not one mention of this Messiah healing the sick and raising the dead. Eusebus tried to forge his work three hundred years after Josephus's death but was found out and acknowledged by theologians that it was a fraud to propogate the myth of Jesus.

Just to put it in straight terms, I do not deny that there was a holy man going around preaching, (the place was filled with them at that point in history) and he may even have been called Jesus, but he is not the myth of the bible.

So, as someone who has studied theology for over thirty five years and debated with ministers and priests throughout that time, not one of these men of the cloth have EVER came up with any documentation of a Jesus Christ, outside the words written anonymously from the four gospels, which were all written between 80 and 150 years after the alleged time of Jesus.

I will await your response with eager anticipation. :rolleyes:

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Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.) Somewhere in the world a man has abducted a little girl, soon he will rape, torture and kill her. If an atrocity of this kind is not occurring at th

Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

Ok' date=' show me the proof that Jesus existed, ( my turn to roll eyes) :rolleyes:. And I don't mean heresay, show me one document or writing from this time in history? He is not mentioned in ANY Roman literature of that time, there is no mention of him in any Jewish chronicles and the Jews were famous for their documentation of history. Josephus, the main Jewish writer around the time of the alleged Jesus, makes not one mention of this Messiah healing the sick and raising the dead. Eusebus tried to forge his work three hundred years after Josephus's death but was found out and acknowledged by theoligians that it was a fraud to propogate the myth of Jesus.

Just to put it in straight terms, I do not deny that there was a holy man going around preaching, (the place was filled with them at that point in history) and he may even have been called Jesus, but he is not the myth of the bible.

So, as someone who has study theology for over thirty five years and debated with ministers and priests throughout that time, not one of these men of the cloth have EVER came up with any documentation of a Jesus Christ, outside the words written anonymously from the four gospels, which were all written between 80 and 150 years after the alleged time of Jesus.

I will await your response with eager anticipation. :rolleyes:[/quote']

If you look a few posts back you will see evidence of Josephus talking about Jesus. There may have been many called Jesus at that time but this one is different in the fact that he was a "doer of wonderful things" and was condemned to die by Pilate. Not only that but he mentions that this Jesus is the man behind Christian's beliefs. Read my post a few posts back, on the previous page; those are but a few and I can provide more if you want.

Better yet I will post what I wrote again

So you say Jesus is not mentioned outside of the four gospels not even by Josephus but that is untrue. I have done some research and if you read Josephus' book Antiquities of the Jews, book xviii chapter 3 paragraph 3 you will see that he talks about a man named Jesus, a "doer of wonderful works" who was condemned to the cross.

Now there was about this time Jesus, a wise man, if it be lawful to call him a man, for he was a doer of wonderful works a teacher of such men as receive the truth with pleasure. He drew over to him both many of the Jews, and many of the Gentiles. He was [the] Christ. And when Pilate, at the suggestion of the principal men among us, had condemned him to the cross, those that loved him at the first did not forsake him; for he appeared to them alive again the third day; as the divine prophets had foretold these and ten thousand other wonderful things concerning him. And the tribe of Christians so named from him are not extinct at this day

The bits in bold were edited in by someone else but the rest is his work.

Tacitus' Annals also talk about a man named "Christus" who was put to death by Pontious Pilate book 15.44

But not all the relief that could come from man, not all the bounties that the prince could bestow, nor all the atonements which could be presented to the gods, avaiIed to relieve Nero from the infamy of being believed to have ordered the conflagration. Hence, to suppress the rumor, he falsely charged with the guilt, and punished with the most exquisite tortures, the persons commonly called Christians, who were hated for their enormities. Christus, the founder of that name, was put to death as a criminal by Pontius Pilate, procurator of Judea in the reign of Tiberius: but the pernicious superstition, repressed for a time, broke out again, not only through Judea, where the mischief originated, but through the city of Rome...

Another from the Jewish Talmud

Perhaps most controversial of all historical references is a possible reference to Jesus in the Jewish Talmud. The passage speaks of someone who was "hanged" because he "practiced sorcery" and "enticed Israel to apostacy". If this passage refers to Jesus, then it is an interesting piece of evidence because it confirm Jesus' influence and that Jesus did perform miracles and healing, though the Talmud attributes His power to sorcery rather than coming from God.
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Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

Ah a great thread and one I shall regularly be posting on,personally I am an athiest and it is what I will always be for the rest of my living days,if people believe in other religions and if you are Christian,Catholic,Protestant or Hindu or follow any religion that is fine by me:),I have always doubted the existence of god and once I read into Evolution it is something I have taken a keen intrest in which lead me to become an athiest,it will be intresting to hear from religious people and seeing why they view and believe in there religion:).

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Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

Whilst similar' date=' you could argue Faith and Opinion hold different interpretations …eg

I have absolute faith in existence of the almighty

I am of the opinion that the almighty exists.

Surely in those sentences, the word Faith holds greater conviction than opinion??

The logic I was suggesting still stands [/color']

I question the fairness of those who deny faith in god ( by physical means)expecting those who hold that faith to justify it in similar terms, how does the individual prove faith in God ? other than the bible what evidence can he bring forward? what terms can he use to meet the physical criteria that Atheist logic requires?

Maybe I am not being clear, let me ask you, what would it take for you to believe in God ?, what would change your mind?

EDIT: Your point on Burden of proof could surely be extended to the Atheist argument, as in the quote from Philippe, what comparable terms could he use to justify his statement to someone who considers the word to be fact ?

EDIT 2 : The burden of proof (Latin: onus probandi) is the obligation to shift the assumed conclusion away from an oppositional opinion to one's own position. The burden of proof may only be fulfilled by evidence. The burden of proof is often associated with the Latin maxim semper necessitas probandi incumbit ei qui agit, the best translation of which seems to be: "the necessity of proof always lies with the person who lays charges." This is a statement of a version of the presumption of innocence which underpins the assessment of evidence in some legal systems, and is not a general statement of when one takes on the burden of proof. The burden of proof tends to lie with anyone who is arguing against received wisdom, but does not always, as sometimes the consequences of accepting a statement or the ease of gathering evidence in its defense might alter the burden of proof its proponents shoulder. The burden may also be assigned institutionally.

He who does not carry the burden of proof carries the benefit of assumption, meaning he needs no evidence to support his claim. Fulfilling the burden of proof effectively captures the benefit of assumption, passing the burden of proof off to another party.

Christianity is a widespread religion with a majority of the population who believe. In fact, it spans into history and culture far and wide, for many centuries. Relative to Christianity, some claim that atheism is a relatively new perspective and philosophy, having fairly recent roots and a minority of believers. The association and affiliation of atheism to science is even newer, as science itself is only several centuries old. From this perspective it stands to reason, that atheism is indeed the accuser against Christianity and therefore suffers the Burden of Proof.

Dave' date=' I have far to much respect for you as an individual to remind you of your numerous comparisons between God and Supernatural Mythology. :P

Nevertheless, help me out here, you have no problem with accepting their maybe a God? But at the same time you have a problem with those who choose to believe in his existence via religious text…is that correct Dave ?[/

That’s a ridiculous claim David, I am not surprised you dissasociated yourself from the figures..obviously using such a claim justifies:

800,000,000 deaths Divided by fifty thousand years of religion = 16000 deaths p/a

WW2 40,000,000 deaths Divided by 6 years (1939-1945) = 6,666,666 deaths p/a

Am I to believe that you are suggesting that after breaking it down to a common denominator ie a year , an athiest war has accounted for more deaths per annum than religious based wars? One wonders what happens if you was to repeat the same process using wars fought in the name of demoracy, power, territorial gain etc etc..

As do I Dave ;)

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Guest ExiledScotInTheUSA

Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

If you look a few posts back you will see evidence of Josephus talking about Jesus. There may have been many called Jesus at that time but this one is different in the fact that he was a "doer of wonderful things" and was condemned to die by Pilate. Not only that but he mentions that this Jesus is the man behind Christian's beliefs. Read my post a few posts back' date=' on the previous page; those are but a few and I can provide more if you want.

Better yet I will post what I wrote again

So you say Jesus is not mentioned outside of the four gospels not even by Josephus but that is untrue. I have done some research and if you read Josephus' book Antiquities of the Jews, book xviii chapter 3 paragraph 3 you will see that he talks about a man named Jesus, a "doer of wonderful works" who was condemned to the cross.

The bits in bold were edited in by someone else but the rest is his work.

Tacitus' Annals also talk about a man named "Christus" who was put to death by Pontious Pilate book 15.44

Another from the Jewish Talmud[/quote']http://www.rationalrevolution.net/articles/jesus_myth_history.htm#1

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Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

Are you sure about that?:rolleyes:

There is a difference between believeing in something and something actually existing.

You misunderstand what I mean by existence. What I mean is that something can exist, but not necessarily in a physical form. Does something not exist if you can't reach out and touch it? Things can exist in your mind, in the written word, in legend etcetera, so technically it exists.

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Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

Wow thats long:o. I don't have time to read all of that tonight but I'll definitely look at it tommorow. It may be 6:30 there but its 23:30 here:o.

As sad as it sounds, this thread is the only reason I am still awake, so I can reply to it, but on second thought I will sleep now:p. Will be back tomoz.

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Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

So its fair to say

Due to the fact that atheists cannot entirely disprove ( via scientific method) that God exists, there is a possibility that he does.

Faith is impossible to prove by physical means.

Organised religion has caused no more deaths than other institutions like fascism, communism or democracy anymore than religious differences has caused more deaths when compared to the quest for power, resources etc.

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Guest ExiledScotInTheUSA

Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

Wow thats long:o. I don't have time to read all of that tonight but I'll definitely look at it tommorow. It may be 6:30 there but its 23:30 here:o.

As sad as it sounds' date=' this thread is the only reason I am still awake, so I can reply to it, but on second thought I will sleep now:p. Will be back tomoz.[/quote']

At least you are willing to read through it :P, so I applaud you for at least wanting to find the truth. I know of many who refuse to read things like this and just accept all that they are fed by society. Get back to me and let me know your thoughts as I am genuinely interested as you seem to me to want to expand your minds beyond the norm :).

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Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

Ah a great thread and one I shall regularly be posting on' date='personally I am an athiest and it is what I will always be for the rest of my living days,if people believe in other religions and if you are Christian,Catholic,Protestant or Hindu or follow any religion that is fine by me:),I have always doubted the existence of god and [b']once I read into Evolution [/b]it is something I have taken a keen intrest in which lead me to become an athiest,it will be intresting to hear from religious people and seeing why they view and believe in there religion:).

There is no tangible evidence that evolution has actually taken place on planet earth. For evolution to have taken place, each animal on earth would have had to change their own genetic material over many millions of years. Now these changes would be so small you wouldn't have been able to notice it in ones lifetime. If this had taken place the evidence would have been found in fossils but so far it has not been found. Adaptation though is very real.

As for the Haiti debate. Lets put things into perspective. Planet earth as we know it is vastly over populated. We (Humans) are bleeding the earth dry of natural resources. Natural disasters happen for specific reasons. In the Natural world it helps with re-growth. Yes creatures and humans die, but its for the good of earth, not for the good of us. The world does not revolve around humans, we are simply nothing but guests - FACT. Earth was here long before us (God made us last), and Earth will be here after us (When the *rapture happens (*Christian belief)).

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Guest ExiledScotInTheUSA

Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

So its fair to say

Due to the fact that atheists cannot entirely disprove ( via scientific method) that God exists' date=' there is a possibility that he does.[/color']

Faith is impossible to prove by physical means.

Organised religion has caused no more deaths than other institutions like fascism, communism or democracy anymore than religious differences has caused more deaths when compared to the quest for power, resources etc.

Faith means belief without proof Dave. Fascism and Communism caused the deaths of millions, no doubt about that, but these regimes were implemented by men of evil intent, what is the reason of the religious crimes against humanity. To try and justify this is absurd. People were murdered simply for believing in other gods, or no gods, others were murdered simply to promote the will of religion on the masses. After all Dave, isn't religion based on love and peace? Or am I still living in the 60's? :).

The religious murders were despicable for those very reasons, they hindered science, denounced free thought.

And to all of you who wonder why I am so against religion. My seven year old daughter gets fed information that the world is 4000 years old and that Adam and Eve was a true story. The evolution is wrong although over 95% of the world's scientists agree in the main although there are some debates, but not on the structure of evolution by modification.

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Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

So its fair to say

Due to the fact that atheists cannot entirely disprove ( via scientific method) that God exists' date=' there is a possibility that he does.

[b']Faith is impossible to prove by physical means.

Organised religion has caused no more deaths than other institutions like fascism, communism or democracy anymore than religious differences has caused more deaths when compared to the quest for power, resources etc.[/b]

Basically its like supporting Man Utd as you dont believe that your local team will ever win the title.

(ok so its not)

But Mr Izod is absolutly spot on!

The only time organised religion killed ppl is when they got the whole idea of thier religious beliefs wrong. Do you believe all Millwall (and others) fans are thugs? nope, They have used football as an excuse to fight, but its everything football isn't.

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Guest ExiledScotInTheUSA

Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

There is no tangible evidence that evolution has actually taken place on planet earth. For evolution to have taken place' date=' each animal on earth would have had to change their own genetic material over many millions of years. Now these changes would be so small you wouldn't have been able to notice it in ones lifetime. If this had taken place the evidence would have been found in fossils but so far it has not been found. Adaptation though is very real. [/color']

As for the Haiti debate. Lets put things into perspective. Planet earth as we know it is vastly over populated. We (Humans) are bleeding the earth dry of natural resources. Natural disasters happen for specific reasons. In the Natural world it helps with re-growth. Yes creatures and humans die, but its for the good of earth, not for the good of us. The world does not revolve around humans, we are simply nothing but guests - FACT. Earth was here long before us (God made us last), and Earth will be here after us (When the *rapture happens (*Christian belief)).

This is just not true Paul. Animals from the Cherynobl explosion have survived the nuclear fall out and adapted. In scientific quarters, changes and modification have taken place over as little as two or three generations.

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Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

This is just not true Paul. Animals from the Cherynobl explosion have survived the nuclear fall out and adapted. In scientific quarters' date=' changes and modification have taken place over as little as two or three generations.[/quote']

Its not the same thing David. It is said that humans evolved from Neanderthals (or some other being) but there is no factual evidence of the change. Its just a theory. We have found Neanderthal fossils, but nothing proving evolution has changed us into Humans, or the fact the Neanderthals evolved from Monkeys. Like I said, genetic modification would have taken place over time so there should be many fossils showing us how we changed, but there is nothing. I was a massive believer of evolution, until I found out there is absolutly no evidence. Adaptation is different. I will use the Fox as an example. If the common foxed moved north to siberia, then it would have to adapt to stay alive. And it did hence the reason we have the Arctic fox, but its still a fox and the change is proven. Evolution would be if the fox changed into a species totally different, and that we have no evidence of. Species can adapt but not change into something different all together (or atleast there is no evidence, only theory).

Its actually quite easy for animals to change, humans have been doing it for years with domestic animals like sheep, dogs and cattle.

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Guest ExiledScotInTheUSA

Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

Its not the same thing David. It is said that humans evolved from Neanderthals (or some other being) but there is no factual evidence of the change. Its just a theory. We have found Neanderthal fossils' date=' but nothing proving evolution has changed us into Humans, or the fact the Neanderthals evolved from Monkeys. Like I said, genetic modification would have taken place over time so there should be many fossils showing us how we changed, but there is nothing. I was a massive believer of evolution, until I found out there is absolutly no evidence. Adaptation is different. I will use the Fox as an example. If the common foxed moved north to siberia, then it would have to adapt to stay alive. And it did hence the reason we have the Arctic fox, but its still a fox and the change is proven. Evolution would be if the fox changed into a species totally different, and that we have no evidence of. Species can adapt but not change into something different all together (or atleast there is no evidence, only theory).[/color']

zi8FfMBYCkk

Take a look at this Paul. He is the top biologist in the USA

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Guest ExiledScotInTheUSA

Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

JVRsWAjvQSg

This takes an hour Paul but if you are really interested in evolution, listen to this guy, he is the top biologist in America.

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Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

After all Dave' date=' isn't religion based on love and peace? Or am I still living in the 60's? :).

[/quote']

And isn't democracy based on freedom and communisim on fairness?, and i suspect if you had the choice you still would be eh mate ;)

I’m sry Dave I don’t wish to appear pedantic but that goes nowhere near justifying yours and others claims that organized religion has caused the majority of wars etc etc…Your observation about faith is quite correct but only serves to support my original inference that, ultimately the lack of a common method of distinguishing what is indeed the absolute truth makes any attempt to disprove the existence of God impossible.

As for my own take on religion, thats back at the start of this enduring and well argued thread but i sincerely think the pros outweigh the cons, i don't think mankind is anywhere near as clever as he thinks he is (yet) and perhaps still needs the counter balance of irrational (?) but on the whole well meaning faith in something bigger than himself.:)

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Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

Ok' date=' show me the proof that Jesus existed, ( my turn to roll eyes) :rolleyes:. And I don't mean heresay, show me one document or writing from this time in history? He is not mentioned in ANY Roman literature of that time, there is no mention of him in any Jewish chronicles and the Jews were famous for their documentation of history. Josephus, the main Jewish writer around the time of the alleged Jesus, makes not one mention of this Messiah healing the sick and raising the dead. Eusebus tried to forge his work three hundred years after Josephus's death but was found out and acknowledged by theologians that it was a fraud to propogate the myth of Jesus.

Just to put it in straight terms, I do not deny that there was a holy man going around preaching, (the place was filled with them at that point in history) and he may even have been called Jesus, but he is not the myth of the bible.

So, as someone who has studied theology for over thirty five years and debated with ministers and priests throughout that time, not one of these men of the cloth have EVER came up with any documentation of a Jesus Christ, outside the words written anonymously from the four gospels, which were all written between 80 and 150 years after the alleged time of Jesus.

I will await your response with eager anticipation. :rolleyes:[/quote']

mate how old are ya?

its called getting into a good library and reading before you start saying this NEVER happened. the evidence is overwhelming and im starting to get tired of responses where you are cemented into your belief and aren't ready to listen to other opinions. IF you genuinly want to know the truth and reasoning behind mine and many other people's belief, I will search out specific documents for you :)

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Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

I want to put this out there. If the biblical variant of "God" exists, we are looking at the most unethical "creator" ever concocted by the masses. What sort of madman sentences all animals on Earth but two of each species to death in a horrific flood (that involved more water that Earth even has:rolleyes:). That's messed up, considering the loving nature of this deity. :mad: And what sort of despotic punishment involves brutally raining fire unto a city of homosexuals? :confused: As far as biblical stories go, I hope God doesn't exist, because he seems to be a clear role model of an authoritarian despot in the ancient world. Couldn't he just have changed his own mistakes?

Consider Heaven and Hell. A few blunders in your life abruptly sends you, because you supposedly "deserve" to concede your soul, mind, and body to the "Lord" if his presumably incorruptible train of thought sees fit, to live an eternity in a realm where you will be forever punished with unbelievably inhumane forms of torture, never to be given the chance to repent and save yourself. You are placed in this position to strive toward an effect worth so little significance in terms of efficiency (this is made with the supposition that souls have "value" to this despot) that you might as well have stayed alive and at least contributed to the world economy by extravagantly spending your cash or have been reissued into the real world, in some other, possibly less human form, to be forced into some sort of labor that may just contribute to the welfare of other people in some divine way. Nah. This most likely imaginary figure instead, when your soul is deemed undeserving of its privileges to life, determines that it is much better, in order to ensure that you are no longer a problem to the human race and to that figure himself, to place you in a position where your soul becomes the object of another despotic ruler (enter Satan), whose Hitler-esque personality is justified as being worthy of existence simply because of its significance in the wonderfully productive :rolleyes: world it presides over, and whose intention is purely to waste your value as a human, torturing you to the point at which absolute non-existence in any realm at all would seem a blessing. This is all justified by the belief, superimposed on your mind as a fact by our amicable fellow, that your value as a human being and your ability to change for the better, which creationists have proven themselves not to believe as possible under any circumstance, have no utter importance once your wrongdoings have been committed. Wait... BUT HE LOVES YOU!!! :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Things can only get more humane. Contrary to popular belief, the concept of Heaven relies in fact on a trait that humanity has yet to - and, according to science, never is going to - achieve: the agreeably impossible trait of perfection. We cannot even begin to assume that God can place you into Heaven in the first place. The criteria is to be more virtuous than sinful, but deep thoughts reveal the preposterousness of it all, as simply wanting to be an individual enriched in virtue with the intention of becoming a passenger on the Heaven boat already makes you greedy in striving for your own success, hence committing the "sin" of avarice. Every attempt to reach this impossible realm is futile, as it is in itself a selfish act to seek personal gain, and the more determined you are to achieve such a position in the afterlife, the more selfish you are being. Now, assuming that you have beaten the impossible test of the gates of Heaven, you must now stay in Heaven. The possibility of any one man, woman, or child retaining such a position is simply nonexistent, so long as the general concept of a being whose personality is so mind-bogglingly consistent in nature that nothing can be exerted, by any other existent being or object, to corrupt that personality, is endorsed as equally impossible. In other words, the only possible form of a human being that even has a shot at surviving an eternity in Heaven is a perfect, incorruptible one, a sort of mental Vesuvian man whose manners could never change for the worse, because you, the average human being, would be compelled by God to surrender your soul to his compatriot and alleged rival, the Devil, to be forced into an infinitely long sentence of unfathomably tortuous imprisonment in impossibly brutal conditions, as you are not a perfect, incorruptible being. So, not only is it impossible for a person of even the most simplistic ambitions and emotions to enter the realm of Heaven, it is just not possible for this person to remain in such a demanding place, as, sooner or later, he or she will blunder and concede his or her life to Satan, and so forth, unless this person is a perfect being, like monotonous ol' God himself. In fact, an infinite afterlife spent in desperate attempt to stay in Heaven would perhaps be even worse imprisonment than being sentenced to Hell. At least in Hell you do not have to wake up every morning (if such a thing exists in this wonderland) knowing that every idea that comes to your mind is constantly being monitored by Thought Police Officer God Almighty for the slightest of blemishes.

I do hope an afterlife of eternal imprisonment in either form does not exist.

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Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

mate how old are ya?

its called getting into a good library and reading before you start saying this NEVER happened. the evidence is overwhelming and im starting to get tired of responses where you are cemented into your belief and aren't ready to listen to other opinions. IF you genuinly want to know the truth and reasoning behind mine and many other people's belief' date=' I will search out specific documents for you :)[/quote']

As I said, I await your proof. :rolleyes:. My thoughts are cemented in rational thinking, not believing in regurgitated mythological stories. If you want to see the jesus story, study every other religion pre christianity and he is there, in the form of Dionysus, Horus, Mithras etc etc, the common bond? They all had virgin mothers, they were all "born" 25th December (Winter Solstice) all sons of god, there over 30 of these 'gods" with all the same background, the only difference is that all prior religions accepted these gods as mythological and not reality....Humpty Dumpty doesn't exist although there is a song about him :rolleyes:

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Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

As I said' date=' I await your proof. :rolleyes:. My thoughts are cemented in rational thinking, not believing in regurgitated mythological stories. If you want to see the jesus story, study every other religion pre christianity and he is there, in the form of Dionysus, Horus, Mithras etc etc, the common bond? They all had virgin mothers, they were all "born" 25th December (Winter Solstice) all sons of god, there over 30 of these 'gods" with all the same background, the only difference is that all prior religions accepted these gods as mythological and not reality....Humpty Dumpty doesn't exist although there is a song about him :rolleyes:[/quote']

mate there is a reason why they were all 'born' on the 25th december. its very rational so think before you speak. if you really want to know and that you can PM

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Guest ExiledScotInTheUSA

Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

mate there is a reason why they were all 'born' on the 25th december. its very rational so think before you speak. if you really want to know and that you can PM

First off, I am not your mate, and I still await your reply; respond to the question in mind then we can move forward.

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Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

First off' date=' I am not your mate, and I still await your reply; respond to the question in mind then we can move forward.[/quote']

okay then here the answer is to the 25th decemeber is this...the church in medieval times wanted their holidays to clash with the original holidays. therefore 25 december is used a lot.

second i have answered countlessly that Jesus existed and if you want sources you can go into a good library and do some work for yourself

i'll believe what i'll believe and you can believe what you want. both of us aren't going to think the other person is wrong so i'll leave it.

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Guest ExiledScotInTheUSA

Re: Religion (A.K.A. The thread destined to fail.)

okay then here the answer is to the 25th decemeber is this...the church in medieval times wanted their holidays to clash with the original holidays. therefore 25 december is used a lot.

second i have answered countlessly that Jesus existed and if you want sources you can go into a good library and do some work for yourself

i'll believe what i'll believe and you can believe what you want. both of us aren't going to think the other person is wrong so i'll leave it.

I think your last statement is the best way out. You have no clue as to what we are talking about, next time you go to the library, pick up a Noddy book, then expand from that.

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