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THE TIME MACHINE - When predictions fail


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The general impression in the SM community is an appraisal of the prediction, the next big thing, but as we will see, as time goes by some of those predictions go terribly wrong. The idea came to me after reading an old post on another forum about how this kid thought that C. Ronaldo - when he first joined Manchester United - was no where near the quality of David Bellion and would never be.

That being said I don't want to sound depreciative of the work these god-like-people that in the attempt of grasping the future of obscure and famous players provide us with information to make the well oiled profit machine. (if only it would be so accessible for real life... :rolleyes:) But that's not what this thread is about, here we take a look at the flip side of the coin, those bad cases of momentary 'genius', that are so funny to revisit.

After searching the forum i came to two conclusions:

1. Trusting your gut instinct is a lot better than narrowing a number on a players ability. Actually see the player in action!

2. A time machine would be really sweet.

So to start it off here are a few examples, and to be fair i should mention the people who had these unlucky remarks bellow most of the time where right on their predictions regarding most players.

Re: Ruano ALEXIS or Ezequiel GARAY ??

I have both! and Kaboul

Re: F.TORRES? sell or what?

(...) I also believe that Torres will take time to adapt in England' date=' so he wouldnt be looking at an increase just yet. [/quote']

Re: Help needed FAST!!

I have just had a bid for Fabio Cannavaro (96) from Utd of Vidic (92) and £5million. I have accepted it intially as Cannavaro is nearly 34 but I am having doubts. What would you guys do in my situation? (...)

The deal wouldnt normally go through. The rival manager is offering too much. I wouldnt accept anyway
Sergio Aguero

This morning i made a bid of £17 million plus Pavel Nedved for Sergio Aguero.

It has been accepted by the other manager but im now thinking to myself whether if i've offered way too much.

Kerzhakov VS Huntelaar

Who is better to buy in your opinion?? (...)

I think their both class.

But i would go for Kerzakhov' date=' given the option[/quote']
van persie

after sending loads of pm to an arsenal manager in my setup' date='he has agreed to sell me van persie , he said i should give him scholes plus 10m . i wanna accept but not too sure,should i go for it?

Re: van persie

No i wouldnt Scholes is 94

Id swap but no money involved.

Crisis

i have daniel alves and ramos and miguel torres . real madrid's coach says he wll use ramos on RB so when he plays he will have a positional change ' date=' having 2 good RB's . and just received an offer for my [b']miguel torres of ribery +$2m[/b]. i'll accept.

Re: a.nesta

ok thx but how much would u say to offer for nesta iv got 37m and heres my team:

GIVEN' date=' Shay G 93

LAHM, Philipp LB/RB 93

CHIVU, Cristian LB/CB 92

[b']EVRA, Patrice LB 91[/b]

BABAYARO, Celestine LB 86

ZAMBROTTA, Gianluca RB/LB 95

CARR, Stephen RB 87 (...)

Re: a.nesta

SELL EVRA ISWELL THEN

IF the compueter buys evra babearo & luque that will give you more money.

Keep Krul your youth Goalie & the other 2 aswell.

Re: Frank Ribery

I sold him for 5 million plus Gago(89) and Seitaridis(91)

Karim BENZEMA

someone has just bid 20 million for him do i accept it ?

Re:Karim BENZEMA

Of course you do!!! but what's his value?

Re:Karim BENZEMA

Accept it. With Baros' date=' Wiltord, Govou, Keita and Fred ahead of him, he's not exactly at the right place.[/quote']

Messi!

hey im the owner of newcastle and i got lionel messi.

atm im top of the table but heaps of contending clubs want to buy him.

heres the list of clubs that r bidding:

arsenal - 15m' date=' podolski, walcott

man u - 20m, grosso, giggs

chelsea - 25m, j.cole

should i accept and if not wat price should i accept if they offer?

Re: Messi!

Out of the 3 Bids I would take the Man Utd one (...)

Re: Players around 90-92 to buy?

A few of the obvious:

Nani - 89 (likely to rise soon) posted in 2007

Gordon - 90

Kalou - 91

Silva - 92

Reyes - 91

Mertesacker - 92

Yaya Toure - 92

Van Persie - 92

Re: Players around 90-92 to buy?

a lot to rise hopefully if given time :

babel

voronin

castillo

agger

pepe WIN!

Ahh those eternal questions...

robin v persie

im currently managing lyon and offered 17 million for persie they replied with 10 million + fred shall i do it?

Re: Fair Deal?

Had an offer of 4 million + Zambrotta for Luis Miguel i countered 7 + Zambrotta

Its worth it isent it?

Nani

I have been offered 10m + aguero for nani do i accept?

accept or reject

i made an bid for torres which was 10million plus shevchenko and the munich coach negociated my offer which is 4million plus shevchenko and toni should i accept it reject??

And finnaly...

Deal or No Deal?

I've got a few deals that have been offered to me in a few of my deals' date=' but I don't know if they are good deals or bad deals for me......

3. Javier Mascherano (My Player) - £28 million plus Pascal Feindouno

Re: Deal or No Deal?

I'd definatelly take Masherano as he's a player that might not get much action

Re: Deal or No Deal?

Mascherano will not get any playing time. At Liverpool now and he faces competition with Xabi Alonso and Gerrard (...) Mascherano - accept

Re: Deal or No Deal?

3. Not sure' date=' 28M alone is a big money but I think Mascherano is great player and should go up so I probably wouldn't accept it ATM till I make sure that he won't be playing in L'pool All hail Zazoon's wisdom

Re: Deal or No Deal?

You Serious!!????

No way he will go up' date=' Hasn't had much playing time and has to compete with the likes of Xabi Alonso and Gerrard[/quote']

Thanks for taking the time to read and feel free to comment and find some more pearls and post them here. Keep in mind to not bump old threads as they may mislead people and is discouraged by SM.

-Quotes are taken from Player Assistance forum, between 07-11-2007 and 08-22-2007

-Quotes with (...) have content cut for the sake of fluency and the quote context was preserved as much as possible.

-Text in red inside the quote are my own comments

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Re: THE TIME MACHINE - When predictions fail

Haha, good effort in uncovering all of this - it must have taken some time to research. My favourite was possibly Mark saying that Benzema wouldn't get a look in at Lyon, which was probably true at the time, but things haven't panned out like that, have they?! I suppose that, at the time, a lot of the deals made a lot of sense, but if you just take them for what ratings the players are right now, then you get some funny deals for sure. Found this one which, considering what RvN will drop to next week, has turned out to be pretty bad advice:

hi ive been offered van nistlerooy plus 40 mill for rooney is it worth it (...)
Go 4 Ruud and 40 mil mate. Cracker of a deal. :D

And do you think that these guys would be asking the same questions today?

Someone offered me 30M+Julio Cesar(92) for Reina(93).

Should i accept? I believe Julio will go to 93 next week but he is 28 yo and Reina 25.. thx in advance

VICENTE' date=' Rodriguez, or David Silva?

Which 1 has more chance of going up, because i can buy either i dont no which.[/quote']

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Re: THE TIME MACHINE - When predictions fail

Good post.

Fabian Delph - tipped to become a regular? Are you joking? He's behind Douglas' date=' Howson, Kilkenny, Johnson, Prutton, Hughes, etc for a starting place. It's not going to happen. There's no doubt that he's promising, made his first appearance for Leeds aged 15! He may get 3 or 4 sub appearances, but he won't be a regular. Sorry if I'm sounding harsh, but I'm just giving the honest truth.

Other than that though, good work.[/quote']

Went on to be named Leeds players of the year and had the 2nd most minutes...

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Re: THE TIME MACHINE - When predictions fail

Good read. Most of the quotes though, have come from a long time ago, where the deal made perfect sense in the short term.

My favourite ever quote along these lines though;

Fabian Delph - tipped to become a regular? Are you joking? He's behind Douglas' date=' Howson, Kilkenny, Johnson, Prutton, Hughes, etc for a starting place. It's not going to happen. There's no doubt that he's promising, made his first appearance for Leeds aged 15! He may get 3 or 4 sub appearances, but he won't be a regular. Sorry if I'm sounding harsh, but I'm just giving the honest truth.

Other than that though, good work.[/quote']

That season he was arguably our best player, and went on to secure a transfer to Villa in the summer.

Sorry Luke :o:D

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Re: THE TIME MACHINE - When predictions fail

Great read

Ahmed what a legend...how wrong can one person get it :P:p

Just hoping I aint got any faux pas that will be uncovered nothing springs to mind of any major clangers but I must have sometime :o:o

Keep posting more it's fantastic looking back on these :)

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Re: THE TIME MACHINE - When predictions fail

Barry Ferguson

Club- Rangers

Rating- 91

Marcos Senna

Club- Villareal

Rating- 91

Re: Barry Ferguson or Marcos Senna

uhm im a celtic fan and as much as i hate barry ferguson hes a greeat player great passer great vision and good leadership and btw if ya didnt know celtic and rangers are the greatest rivalry in world football imo

..............

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  • 5 weeks later...

Re: THE TIME MACHINE - When predictions fail

THANK YOU FOR THIS THREAD!

seriously, most posters here need to stop riding fads and do some homework.

think back, i'm sure if you've been playing more than a year there's a bonehead move you've seen. for instance: i bought Hazard in a competitive site when he was 75-rated for NOTHING and with no competition; at that time, Juventus had a no-trade on Bojan after buying him for 60 million pound.

analyse that: one extremely good prospect was completely ignored and was bought for nothing, while another was coveted to a point where even bidding on him became impossible. AND THEY ARE BOTH PRETTY EQUAL IN THERMS OF POTENTIAL!!!

so, what's the difference between those deals? Bojan has fallen out of favour, dropped 1, but is still at the biggest club in the world (arguably). Me, well i paid doodly-squat for a guy who i had 1ST HAND PROOF would not just rise but become an integral part of my club.

both are great talents. both will play for years to come. but look at how panic affects deals. 60 million for Bojan now is outrageous, and only happened because every manager in the league was salivating over Bojan's press reports, while Hazard had fallen out of most press when that figure was applied.

as of today, you could probably get both players for a similar price.

why do we all hate Real Madrid? because they intentionally destroy markets whenever they need press. what do we do when we all panic about one player, throw him up on some ******* pedestal? we do the same.

STOP PANICKING!

STOP SAYING "blank i s the next blank".

DO SOME HOMEWORK AND TRUST YOUR ******* GUT.

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Re: THE TIME MACHINE - When predictions fail

Haha' date=' good effort in uncovering all of this - it must have taken some time to research. My favourite was possibly Mark saying that Benzema wouldn't get a look in at Lyon, which was probably true at the time, but things haven't panned out like that, have they?! I suppose that, at the time, a lot of the deals made a lot of sense, but if you just take them for what ratings the players are right now, then you get some funny deals for sure. Found this one which, considering what RvN will drop to next week, has turned out to be pretty bad advice:[/quote']

Yeah, it was true at the time. I'd always been a big fan of Benzema and I think I was the first to mention him when he was at 83. I'm pretty sure it was a short term question, or I would've said keep him.

Speaking of Benzema, here's a legendary one where I'm on the other side of the coin.

Benz could be 93 before the end of the season. He'll be 91-92 at the next rating changes alone.
He aint is Good as nasri hence why a think he should be rated 90 a really think hes a Avg player just on a bit of a confidence streak just nw

just my opinion tho

Should be at least 91' date=' and at least 92 if he keeps playing and scoring for france and lyon maybe even 93/94 dependable on how many goals and assists. Anyway dont sell him for that[/quote']
Totally agree Greig. I think had Benzema been so good' date=' he would've went to 90/91 in the last rating changes. The lad is young and has great potential to be a future star, but 90 at the next rating changes for France is fine :P[/quote']
Okay lads' date=' 93/94 :o

I think we're getting a tad carried away here. Yes he is doing great for club and has broken onto the national scene, but do you know where exactly you are placing him, with such a high rating. This rating will put him alongside Kanoute, Klose, Toni, Trezeguet, Tevez, Owen, Raul and Torres to name a few. Clearly the lad is not in the same bracket as these guys, and this rating will also make him better than Van Persie, Farfan, Fred, Di Natale, Kuranyi etc. which he also clearly isn't at the moment.[/quote']

Put this on forum arhive or something

Greig Spence - Karim Benzema will not be a 92+ before the end of the season in may' date=' mark my words

If he is all give all my teams up and gold membership up and Put my Display picture of me Naked thats how confident I am he aint good enough for a 92 :D:D:D

[/b']

Sure enough; Benzema got the 93 in March. These posts were october. I still havn't seen my Greig naked though. Maybe future tabloid material in Celtic circles?

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Re: THE TIME MACHINE - When predictions fail

Benzema was a strange case. Never would SM do his rating these days. It's a funny old world, football these days, and quite fickle. And who would not give their right arm for a crystal ball. Who would have thunk that Pique would have done so well after leaving Man. Utd, or that Van Der Saar would have joined Fulham, as one of the best goalkeepers in the world. Or the news that most blew me away, Mascherano and Tevez joined West Ham. Come again. :confused: That was my biggest, what moment, in footballing terms.

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Re: THE TIME MACHINE - When predictions fail

Who would have thunk that Pique would have done so well after leaving Man. Utd.

From July of 2007:

Player name: Gerard PIQUE

Age: 20yrs

Nationality: Spanish

Position: Centre Back/Defensive Midfield

Rating: 87

Value: £6.1M

Club : Manchester United (Premiership)

His Story : Has a season starting for a quality Liga team under his belt already. Will be the best defender in the world in 5 seasons.

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Re: THE TIME MACHINE - When predictions fail

Back on topic. All from July 2007.

Player name: LUIZAO

Age: 20yrs

Nationality: Brazilian

Position: Centre Back

Rating: 84

Value: £4.2M

Club : Cruzeiro (Brazil 1)

His story : I see him moving to Europe and being influential' date=' in the style of Alex or Naldo.[/quote']

Moved to Uzbekistan, not Europe. Now plays in Iran.

Player name: LEANDRO LIMA

Age: 19yrs

Nationality: Brazilian

Position: Left Midfield/Attacking Midfield

Rating: 83 (Now 85)

Value: £3.7M (4.9M)

Club : FC Porto (BWIN Liga)

His Story : Just transferred from Sao Caetano. Expected to replace Anderson at Porto' date=' and is a very exiting player who works until he cannot go any further. Brilliant acquisition for any team. Get him.[/quote']

Flopped entirely. Back at Cruzeiro, not playing much.

Player name: Dawid JANCZYK

Age: 19yrs

Nationality: Polish

Position: Attacking Midfield/Striker

Rating: 83

Value: £3.7M

Club : CSKA Moskva (Russian Elite League)

His Story : This kid is crazy good. He’s just 19 and already has scored 9 times for Legia Warszawa' date=' the top Polish club. Just transferred to CSKA, I can’t wait to see how he’ll do. Definitely worth a buy.[/quote']

Is now somewhere in Belgium? Help Abdel?

Player name: Matías VIDANGOSSY

Age: 20yrs

Nationality: Chilean

Position: Striker

Rating: 83

Value: £3.6M

Club : Villareal (Liga)

His Story : After two dominant season for Union Espanola' date=' he’s headed for Spain. One of the most naturally skilled players in the tournament, he’ll become a fan favourite at Villareal. Already mentionned on the forum by nav, I believe. Get him, he’s going to be a star someday.[/quote']

Is now being mentionned as a possible reinforcement for a lower Brazilian side. He's back in Chile, never panned out.

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Re: THE TIME MACHINE - When predictions fail

I haven't been that long around, but here's some of mine.

Godin or Giorgio Chiellini?

Thx for the help.

Chiellini!!!
I need help on a few deals. I can get the following players :

1) Luis Anderson for 35m.

2) Gago for 28m. (Will he get playing time at RM? Btw' date=' for my team, he'd be a starter, alongside Makoun; the other CMs are all rated 89.)

3) Mamadou Sakho for 12m. (I have Subotic, Marcano, Otamendi & Carrico as my youth team CBs, but Sakho is quite a talent, after all.)

Are any of these deals worth doing?

(Thanks in advance for the help. :))[/quote']

Well' date=' 1st one depends from the setup. It looks like this season Anderson will be a starter for MU and he's a talent. If the setup is old, where money is nearly worthless(or players don't do non-exchange deals/players are very hard to get), do it.

2nd one - no. 28m is a waste of money for him. I really don't think he will start cause Lass, M. Diarra, X. Alonso in front of him in the DM role and other players should also get him less time (like Sneijder, if he stays). 2nd reason and much bigger one is that Gago isn't really good. He might play 1 or 2 great passes through-out the game, but his heading is non existant, he frequently losses the ball and I don't see that changing any time soon.

3rd one - I'd say yes. From what I've heard, he's a very big talent and a great defender, so I'd say yes.

Hope that helped :)[/quote']

I've looked over all of my advices that I've found and the only one that I'd change is that I suggest to keep Rafael instead of Balloteli :mad:

Now some other interesting ones ;)

:D I am barcelona in a wc and just accepted 10 million Muntari and Quaresma for Iniesta i think this is a great deal what do you guys think? i know iniesta may hit 96 but i feel the two in return are great talents and regulars Muntari i think will hit 92 this season while Quaresma maybe 94 anyone agree/disagree

:D

will get my rep book out for replies

thanks

I was about to think OMG your getting Iniesta you fool! :D But Quaresma and Muntari both look great aquisitions. Nice Deal :)

Oh Sammy' date=' Sammy, Sammy...

In a bit of need for some help

Ive been offered Kuranyi (92) and Rakitic (89) for Diego Milito (93)

Should i accpect his offer or reject it.

I think it's a good deal, but i would like your views.

I think it's a good deal Louis. Can't see Milito going any higher than 93' date=' while the others could well get higher especially Rakitic. I would go for it ;)[/quote']
BUT!!!

Milito will be and should be 94 IMO!!

Kuranyi wont go higher than 92 IMO!!

Well, what do you know... :D Dai can sometimes be actually right :eek:

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Re: THE TIME MACHINE - When predictions fail

I Originally Posted by Smartdoc

I think it's a good deal Louis. Can't see Milito going any higher than 93' date=' while the others could well get higher especially Rakitic. I would go for it :[/quote']

Oh dear! :( Just as well I generally steer clear of player assistance these days :P

Anyway, moving swiftly on :o, one I remember seeing around 1 year ago and thinking to myself that this will come back and bite someone in the backside:

Re:Henry or Drogba?

Who gets the better deal? Who would you rather have?

I appreciate your help and input.

Thierry Henry is the far better player to have mate.

Drogba hasn't played properly for a season and a half' date=' and is just coming back now but he isn't exactly setting the world on fire.

Henry is performing very well for Barca, playing all the time and he's playing really good football with them, and he's got 12 league goals to his name this season so far. (Drogba scored 9 league goals in the last 2 seasons (and only got 1 this season).

IMO a rise back up to 96 is not off the cards, but no way will he drop.

Drogba on the other hand has to drop, Chelski are underperforming and he is in no way playing to a 96 standard.

So Henry is definately the better player to have.[/quote']

I'll choose Henry. He has fully settled with Barca n his role as left forward. Has 50/50 chance to back to 96 while Drogba surely drop to 95

Another one with 3 players involved and had some interesting responses :P: (we are about 2 years on now from the time of the query)

Re: 30 M + Giovani Dos Santos + Stevan Jovetic for Bojan?

So' date=' do you guys think this is a good deal? Cash doesn't really have much value in my setup as all the top players have been taken, but would come in handy signing youth prospects from external clubs. I'm the owner of Bojan btw. Please let me know your thoughts on the deal. Any help at all would be much appreciated and will be rewarded with rep. ;)[/quote']
Although Bojan arguably has more potential and has done more so far in his young career than the other two' date=' I can't help but think this is not a good deal. The other side of the deal is getting two youngsters, who easily could end up having a better career than Bojan even if doesn't look that way currently. On top of that 30 million could buy an established star. No deal is my opinion if you're getting Bojan

I fear all discussion will be academic anyway as there is no way this deal will pass the chairman stage :([/quote']

Although I do agree on most terms in Smartdocs response' date=' I have a few problems. A) Mexican players usually don't develop into good players in England, and I don't see Giovani Dos Santos getting very far, I think he will be a nery castillo type of player. B) I think Stevan Jovetic is another prospect that really won't get anywhere. C) Bojan will be the next Messi, and he is one of the few players that I would never sell, unless offered a under29 96 rated player. But ofcourse Smartdoc is wise in his opinion so Idk :P.

For Me it is: No deal, keep Bojan[/quote']

I'd sell him. Jovetic has just signed for Fiorentina' date=' and looks like being a squad player (much like Bojan was). I can see Jovetic hitting 89 or so next season. As for Giovani, he should be playing regularly for Spurs next season, and is likely to play for the Mexican national team as well, so he might even hit 90+.

I'd definitely do the deal.[/quote']

i totally agree with Seftinho. There has been so much talk about Giovani Dos Santos all over the forum. more than Bojan. I am sure Dos Santos will rise when the english rating changes are done so in the long-term a brilliant buy.

accept right away. not only do you get two great young talents' date=' you also get 30m with that which could go to even more young talents.

its a great opportunity to boost your team[/quote']

You will regret it in 3 years when you have two 92's that won't rise much more' date=' and you see Bojan with a 95, on course for a 97. :D[/quote']
He isn't that amazing? Are you sure?! Making his debut for Barcelona only as month after turning 17 and scored over 800 goals in the various Barca youth teams. He's also scored regularly for the Spanish youth teams and was called up to the full national team but didn't play as he was injured.

Barca sold Giovani who in himself is a great player' date=' simply because they have Bojan and rate him more highly.

This kid will be one of the worlds best players within 2-3 years.[/quote']

That just sums up my reckoning on the issue. I've always felt that Dos Santos and Jovetic are soild' date=' 90+ players - but nothing more than that. While Bojan - he's got tremendous potential and to me he looks like the new Lionel Messi. I mean a guy rated 89 at the tender age of 17 says it all, doesn't it? :eek:

So after much deliberation I've decided not to go ahead with the deal. Thanx to all you guys for your help, it's been greatly appreciated[/quote']

you cant honestly say that jovetic is a prospect that will do nothing because you dont no that' date=' any of these 3 players could turn out better, its how they mature.[/quote']

To be fair, we still don't know what the value of the deal will be in the future and which of the three players will reach the top. It's interesting how for most of the discussion Bojan and Dos Santos were seemingly the ones we were all rating most, whilst everyone was disregarding Jovetic. Arguably, he's the one who's made most strides in recent years. I put mousey's comment in at the end as it's perhaps the most poignant - no-one can tell with youngsters who will turn out the best. Development is affected by so many factors (staying fit, getting playing time, correct guidance, etc). It's good to see that some ofthe best are equally culpable in some instances as the mere mortals (like me) of the forum :)

PS Loving this thread and there must be some great examples in the help with deals thread if someone has some spare time :D

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Re: THE TIME MACHINE - When predictions fail

Bet this guys is kicking himself

Originally Posted by Hissan

he could buy david villa 4 berbatov and gareth bale and 2-3 mil.is villa a better player for his tottenham then berbatov?or should he stay with berbatov and wait for the next season and bring in eto or villa

Originally Posted by Darshan J

I wouldn't pay Berbatov and Bale for Villa. berbs is having a brilliant season while valencia are fluctuating between the uefa cup spots and mid table this season. They havent won in six games and David Villa has made 10 starts (of their18) and scored only 4.

He might decrease

Originally Posted by Lukelufc

I wouldnt trade out berbatov or bale, bale is settling in nicely (though injured) and berbatov is scoring goals and attracting interest from bigger clubs, also villa hasnt been his best this season.

And another good one...

Originally Posted by Tron

I've been offered Eto for Tevez in my Man Utd squad...I'm considering taking it. Is it worth it?

Originally Posted by Toro De Libano

I wouldn't do it because Tevez is a better long term investment. He also plays more regularly for Man Utd than Eto'o does for Barcelona. So I'd reject. But if you have the cash, and want Eto'o, there is no reason not to buy him.

Originally Posted by Nasir Ali

No deal mate. Tevez will just keep getting better wityh his current form. Eto'o is world class but Tevez is a better investment. All you have to do with Tevez is have patience.

also found this little gem

Originally Posted by Tron

I need a spare LB and LM in my new Lyon squad and have been offered 10m + Giggs + Evra for Juninho.

Is this worth it?

Originally Posted by Shelbourne FC

i woudent Giggs is Aging, Your Probily Have Good Defeders Allready ?

Juninho is Still Class.. Id Keep Him

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Re: THE TIME MACHINE - When predictions fail

also found this little gem
Originally Posted by Tron

I need a spare LB and LM in my new Lyon squad and have been offered 10m + Giggs + Evra for Juninho.

Is this worth it?

Originally Posted by Shelbourne FC

i woudent Giggs is Aging' date=' Your Probily Have Good Defeders Allready ?

Juninho is Still Class.. Id Keep Him [/quote']

HA! That one is pure quality! Imagine offering that today - £10m plus a 94-rated LB who is arguably the best full-back in the world, plus a 93-rated midfielder who just seems to be getting better with age, all in exchange for an 87-rated midfielder who's career is all but over. Yeh, I think I'd keep Juninho as well! :P

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