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Official Liverpool Thread

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

Lol' date=' because managers are always right! Even Mourinho has its stupid decisions as a manager.

I wish there was a guy like Balo in Benfica a couple of seasons ago to take the ball from Cardozo when there was a penalty, he did missed about half dozen, and he was still the designated penalty taker by Jorge Jesus.

Such fuss over nothing, Balotelli didn't rip the ball of Henderson's hands, he went there and Henderson let him take it, because he knew he was the right guy for the job, he was ready to take it, and they should just let him take it instead of being mad like prima donas.

Penalty's shouldn't be manager orders, the guy that takes it is the one that is most confident and skilled to do it.[/quote']

No managers are not always right! They all make mistakes,thats not the point at all here..

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

No managers are not always right! They all make mistakes' date='thats not the point at all here..[/quote']

The points is that Henderson had to take the penalty because he was captain and that was the managers orders. That's a bunch of bull.

Just because Gerrard is captain and a good penalty taker doesn't mean Henderson is both too.

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

The captain doesn't have a God given right to take penalties, free-kicks or corners.

Of course, the manager is the one to make the final call on those decisions, so I'm confused as to why Rodgers would choose a player that's taken one penalty (and he missed) in his professional career over one of the best penalty takers in Europe, in a game that is 0-0 with only minutes left. Gerrard has always been the best choice because he's the always been the best penalty taker at Liverpool, not purely because he's the captain.

Regardless of whether or not Balotelli was disrespectful towards Henderson/Rodgers (he was, but only slightly), he was right to be annoyed. I know I would be if I was the best man for the job and wasn't asked to take the penalty because an inexperienced team mate had the captains arm band on.

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

According to the posts I've just read then, some folk think that:-

1. Players that do what they want regardless of managers instructions are showing good initiative and we should have more of this.

2. If Mario hadn't taken the penalty we might not have won and this is all that matters.

3. In a hypothetical situation Mario's actions might have won us the FA Cup or the Europa

Good lord.

I'll take this, point by point:-

1. Which players are allowed to following instructions and which aren't? As I see it Balotelli has played less minutes and been of less use to this team than EVRY other player than played for us last night - why is he allowed to do his own thing over other folks who have more claim to do so?

2. You don't know anymore than I do as to what the result of Sturridge, Henderson etc taking that penalty would have been so how is this a defence of Balotelli publicly embarrassing his manager, his captain and the club? Statistically he improves the chances of success yes, but this is still not the point - its NOT HIS DECISION TO MAKE.

3. The clubs chances of reaching the final of the FA Cup, the Europa or any other tournament including the league in the first place are weakened if the players are allowed carte blanch with the managers instructions.

Seriously, if individuals cannot see the issue with the Manager being undermined - clearly supported by the club captain in Gerrard, the captain on the night in Henderson and senior players like Sturridge - then I'm lost for words.

The fans claiming balo was right seemingly know more about the team set up and roles than Rodgers, Gerrard, Studge and Hendo - cant you see how ridiculous that makes your stance????

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

By the way,just seen that Coutinho has started every game since December 2nd,surely he needs a little bit rest time? With Ibe and Markovic able to perform well lately,Lallana back from injury and Manquillo/Johnson able to cover for RWB position,surely it's time to let Coutinho on the bench?

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

Lol' date=' because managers are always right! Even Mourinho has its stupid decisions as a manager.

I wish there was a guy like Balo in Benfica a couple of seasons ago to take the ball from Cardozo when there was a penalty, he did missed about half dozen, and he was still the designated penalty taker by Jorge Jesus.

[b']Such fuss over nothing, Balotelli didn't rip the ball of Henderson's hands, he went there and Henderson let him take it, because he knew he was the right guy for the job, he was ready to take it, and they should just let him take it instead of being mad like prima donas.

Penalty's shouldn't be manager orders, the guy that takes it is the one that is most confident and skilled to do it[/b].

Almost all of this is incorrect.

1. Balo took the ball from his captain.

2. Henderson is clearly unhappy - he didn't think "yeah, he's the right man" at all - have you even seen the incident? He looks to the manager for assistance, he puts his hands out in frustration, he walks away shaking his head, muttering his frustration

3. Its Mario that's clearly the prima donna here - imagine if Sturridge and others decided to have the same attitude as Balo, basically a full on wrestle for the ball would develop.

4. Penalties shouldn't be the managers decision? So what, whenever a penalty is awarded we should allow five minutes for discussion between players? They should draw straws? The guy that takes it is the most confident? No, based on your process its merely the guy that makes the most noise.

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

The captain doesn't have a God given right to take penalties' date=' free-kicks or corners.

Of course, [b']the manager is the one to make the final call on those decisions[/b], so I'm confused as to why Rodgers would choose a player that's taken one penalty (and he missed) in his professional career over one of the best penalty takers in Europe, in a game that is 0-0 with only minutes left. Gerrard has always been the best choice because he's the always been the best penalty taker at Liverpool, not purely because he's the captain.

Regardless of whether or not Balotelli was disrespectful towards Henderson/Rodgers (he was, but only slightly), he was right to be annoyed. I know I would be if I was the best man for the job and wasn't asked to take the penalty because an inexperienced team mate had the captains arm band on.

All of this I agree with - 100% - bar the god given right of the Captain. If he is the captain he is chosen to lead. If the manager has not specifically instructed a penalty taker then the Captain makes the decision. He has the right to decide as he has been put in the position of power to make that decision. Now he can make a poor decision but he has to make that decision. If not, then what is he there for?

The bit I've highlighted though is the whole point of the debate, that's it in a nutshell.

Mario Balotelli is a player not the manager - its not his decision to make. End of.

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

Mario Balotelli – A Footballing Life of Headlines

2007 – Manchini leaves Inter Milan and Mario’s discipline hits the skids. Manchini says “I told him, if you played with me 10 years ago I would give you every day maybe one punch in your head. There are different ways to help a guy like Mario. I don't speak with him every day, otherwise I would need a psychologist”

2008 – Mourinho accuses Mario of a lack of effort in training “as far as I'm concerned, a young boy like him cannot allow himself to train less than people like Figo, Córdoba, and Zanetti”

2009 – Mourinho suspends Mario over “disciplinary problems”

2009 – Following a draw with Roma Mourinho publically rates Balotelli as a zero for his performance

2010 - The tension between Balotelli and Mourinho reached its peak on the eve of the UEFA Champions League second leg against Chelsea after the young striker was not called-up, following an altercation with his manager. Balotelli was criticized by several senior players including captain Javier Zanetti[47] and veteran defender Marco Materazzi, as well as by his own agent.

2010 – Mario appears on Italian TV in an AC Milan shirt – Mario is an Inter Milan player.

2010 – Mario throws his shirt on the ground, in response to Inter fans who had booed him for his poor performance at the end of the game vs Barca in champo league semi final. Disgruntled fans confronted and tried to attack Balotelli after the game. His behavior on the pitch brought disapproval from his teammates, with Zanetti publicly saying "Mario needs to focus on doing what he can do on the pitch, he can't allow himself to behave like this” Rumours of a fight between balotelli and his team mates in the dressing room emerge.

2010 - Balotelli and a group of friends fired air pistols in the open in Milan's Piazza della Repubblica

2010 – Leaves Inter and signs for Manchester City where previous Inter coach Manchini states “Mario arrives with a clean slate and a second chance”

2010 - Within days of joining Manchester City, Balotelli was involved in a car crash.[157] It was reported that Balotelli was carrying £5,000 cash at the time – and that when a police officer asked why he had such a large sum of cash Balotelli replied: "Because I am rich”

2010 – Photos emerge of a significant training ground physical bust up with Manchini at City

2010 – Disciplined by the club when caught throwing darts at a youth team player during a training ground prank

2010 – He wins the Golden Boy Award, saying that only one of the past winners was slightly better than he was – Lionel Messi. He also claims to not know who runner up Jack Wilshere is.

2011 - Balotelli stamps on Scott Parker against Tottenham Hotspur.

2011 - Video showing Balotelli requiring assistance to put on a training bib goes viral

2011 - Balotelli squabbles with Aleksandar Kolarov over a free kick and recieves criticism from Manchini who says he was ready to take him off after 5 mins

2011 - Balotelli seen using his iPad whilst on the substitutes' bench for Italy during their game with the Faroe Islands

2011 – Balotelli drives into a womens prison and gets into trouble with the law – he claims he merely “wanted to have a look around”

2011 - Balotelli and his friends set house on fire when a firework was let off in it, and later that week Balotelli was unveiled as Greater Manchester's ambassador for firework safety

2011 – Unveils tshirt with "Why always me?" on it when scoring against United

2011 - Balotelli breaks a 48-hour curfew before City's game against Chelsea to go to a curry house

2012 – on receiving his fourth red card of the season Machini publicly states Balo will not play for his side again and will be sold in the summer. (however he does – even setting up Aguero’s title winner in the last minute of the season)

2012 - When Inter Milan (Balotelli's former club) held a press conference for their new manager Andrea Stramaccioni, Balotelli gatecrashed the event

2012 - Balotelli reinforced his threats to walk off the pitch if any of the opposition's fans racially abuse him in any way, and said he would 'kill' anyone that threw a banana at him

2012 - Mario Balotelli scored his first goal in a major international - when he attempted to celebrate this goal, he was immediately halted by teammate Leonardo Bonucci, who covered Balotelli's mouth with his hand for fear that the striker would say something to "get in trouble

2012 - Balotelli's former girlfriend claimed that she was pregnant with his child, Balotelli responded by claiming that he would only assume paternal responsibilities upon a positive paternity test

2012 - Former girlfriend accuses Balotelli of being "irresponsible" and "not interested" in her newborn daughter - Balotelli threatens to take legal action against Fico to defend his reputation.

2012 – Having missed 11 games of the season through suspension, Mario fights a club fine for poor discipline, taking the club to tribunal. Less than a day before the court hearing, he drops the case and accepts the fine.

2013 – Mario joins AC Milan - It was stated that Silvio Berlusconi's signing of Balotelli would help him gain extra votes in the 2013 Italian general election.

2014 - Balotelli finally acknowledged paternity of his daughter Pia following a positive DNA test

2014 – Mario joins Liverpool

2014 - Brendan Rodgers criticises him for swapping shirts with Pepe at half time, saying "It's something that doesn't happen here and shouldn't happen here”

2014 - One match suspension and £25,000 fine for posting anti-Semitic and racist references on social media

2015 – Scores winner vs Besiktas from the spot, following altercation with captain over who was to it.

Career Stats:-

Club…………………………National

170…………Played…………33

67…………..Scored…………13

51……….Yellow Cards…….5

4…………..Red Cards……….1

So here’s the question:-

Is he worth the hassle?

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

100% spot on Ed

All of these people are dealing in Hypotheticals what if henderson missed how about what if he scored???

People are saying it's ok because he scored, but that is not the point and the fact so few people seem to actually see the bigger point is disturbing

What is the point of having a heirachy, what is the point of having a manager, what is the point of having a Captain if some players believe they are above taking there place in the Heirachy.

It is the managers call that is what he is payed for to take decisions

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

I haven't seen anyone else have such effectiveness while making it look so effortless.

Agreed. But I preferred / look more onto placing shot technique rather than starting run technique when it comes to converting penalty.

Nope' date=' Reina made it seem like he was diving left, by going right-left but he had reactions and the strength to go right-left-right.[/quote']He always done that in every penalty, not just again Balo's.

It's hardly a obvious movement left-right-or-something he just lean forward to get the extra jump.

7Uy3uDSYuOk

My point is, he stood his ground until the last minute and Balo had no choice just to take it or he would be foul for a stop gap, and Reina is really, really quick. That's why he is one of the best penalty stopper in modern football.

If it was so easy to save it, more goalies would. His shot is a soft placement, but completely destroys practically every goalie in the world.
Who said it was easy to save?

Most experience goalkeeper would stood his ground until the final second, that's the risk with Balo's technique.

Compared Reina and Besiktas's goalkeeper, and you can see Besiktas's goalkeeper commits rather early.

Another one that he missed; the goalkeeper just stood there until last minute.

12eGK_YqPIU

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

Haha this is actually quite amusing. :)

At the end of day , The manager makes the decisions and he chose Hendo to take the pen and for Balo to come for 10/15 mins I think and for him to take it off Hendo and then argue with Danny and Hendo what gives him the right his arrogance is unreal.

Rightly or wrongly the manager makes the decisions , Hes the one that gets sacked if he made the wrong decision in putting Hendo as pen taker thats his to make not some arrogant muppet that can barely score from open play!. And to the people saying he scored which is all very well but you saw what stevie said last night?

Theres going to be disharmony in the dressing room and a lot of ill feeling towards Balo and was it worth it as I think Hendo would have scored. And what if he missed it? You guys would have crucified him for snatching that away from Hendo.

At the end of the day , I believe in managers orders and respect for your captains. But everyone has a opinion but just ask yourself would have said the same if he missed it :)

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

The points is that Henderson had to take the penalty because he was captain and that was the managers orders. That's a bunch of bull.

Just because Gerrard is captain and a good penalty taker doesn't mean Henderson is both too.

Missing the point again...

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

Hendo was named spot kick taker prior to KO and Mario being on the pitch. If BR really wanted Hendo to take that pen he would of it's as simple as that. The fact that BR let Mario take it tells me he had no problem with it and probably preferred it. It was a big pen so your best spot kick taker has to take it. Amount of fuss been made over it is embarrassing.

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

Mario Balotelli – A Footballing Life of Headlines

2007 – Manchini leaves Inter Milan and Mario’s discipline hits the skids. Manchini says “I told him' date=' if you played with me 10 years ago I would give you every day maybe one punch in your head. There are different ways to help a guy like Mario. I don't speak with him every day, otherwise I would need a psychologist”

2008 – Mourinho accuses Mario of a lack of effort in training “as far as I'm concerned, a young boy like him cannot allow himself to train less than people like Figo, Córdoba, and Zanetti”

2009 – Mourinho suspends Mario over “disciplinary problems”

2009 – Following a draw with Roma Mourinho publically rates Balotelli as a zero for his performance

2010 - The tension between Balotelli and Mourinho reached its peak on the eve of the UEFA Champions League second leg against Chelsea after the young striker was not called-up, following an altercation with his manager. Balotelli was criticized by several senior players including captain Javier Zanetti[47'] and veteran defender Marco Materazzi, as well as by his own agent.

2010 – Mario appears on Italian TV in an AC Milan shirt – Mario is an Inter Milan player.

2010 – Mario throws his shirt on the ground, in response to Inter fans who had booed him for his poor performance at the end of the game vs Barca in champo league semi final. Disgruntled fans confronted and tried to attack Balotelli after the game. His behavior on the pitch brought disapproval from his teammates, with Zanetti publicly saying "Mario needs to focus on doing what he can do on the pitch, he can't allow himself to behave like this” Rumours of a fight between balotelli and his team mates in the dressing room emerge.

2010 - Balotelli and a group of friends fired air pistols in the open in Milan's Piazza della Repubblica

2010 – Leaves Inter and signs for Manchester City where previous Inter coach Manchini states “Mario arrives with a clean slate and a second chance”

2010 - Within days of joining Manchester City, Balotelli was involved in a car crash.[157] It was reported that Balotelli was carrying £5,000 cash at the time – and that when a police officer asked why he had such a large sum of cash Balotelli replied: "Because I am rich”

2010 – Photos emerge of a significant training ground physical bust up with Manchini at City

2010 – Disciplined by the club when caught throwing darts at a youth team player during a training ground prank

2010 – He wins the Golden Boy Award, saying that only one of the past winners was slightly better than he was – Lionel Messi. He also claims to not know who runner up Jack Wilshere is.

2011 - Balotelli stamps on Scott Parker against Tottenham Hotspur.

2011 - Video showing Balotelli requiring assistance to put on a training bib goes viral

2011 - Balotelli squabbles with Aleksandar Kolarov over a free kick and recieves criticism from Manchini who says he was ready to take him off after 5 mins

2011 - Balotelli seen using his iPad whilst on the substitutes' bench for Italy during their game with the Faroe Islands

2011 – Balotelli drives into a womens prison and gets into trouble with the law – he claims he merely “wanted to have a look around”

2011 - Balotelli and his friends set house on fire when a firework was let off in it, and later that week Balotelli was unveiled as Greater Manchester's ambassador for firework safety

2011 – Unveils tshirt with "Why always me?" on it when scoring against United

2011 - Balotelli breaks a 48-hour curfew before City's game against Chelsea to go to a curry house

2012 – on receiving his fourth red card of the season Machini publicly states Balo will not play for his side again and will be sold in the summer. (however he does – even setting up Aguero’s title winner in the last minute of the season)

2012 - When Inter Milan (Balotelli's former club) held a press conference for their new manager Andrea Stramaccioni, Balotelli gatecrashed the event

2012 - Balotelli reinforced his threats to walk off the pitch if any of the opposition's fans racially abuse him in any way, and said he would 'kill' anyone that threw a banana at him

2012 - Mario Balotelli scored his first goal in a major international - when he attempted to celebrate this goal, he was immediately halted by teammate Leonardo Bonucci, who covered Balotelli's mouth with his hand for fear that the striker would say something to "get in trouble

2012 - Balotelli's former girlfriend claimed that she was pregnant with his child, Balotelli responded by claiming that he would only assume paternal responsibilities upon a positive paternity test

2012 - Former girlfriend accuses Balotelli of being "irresponsible" and "not interested" in her newborn daughter - Balotelli threatens to take legal action against Fico to defend his reputation.

2012 – Having missed 11 games of the season through suspension, Mario fights a club fine for poor discipline, taking the club to tribunal. Less than a day before the court hearing, he drops the case and accepts the fine.

2013 – Mario joins AC Milan - It was stated that Silvio Berlusconi's signing of Balotelli would help him gain extra votes in the 2013 Italian general election.

2014 - Balotelli finally acknowledged paternity of his daughter Pia following a positive DNA test

2014 – Mario joins Liverpool

2014 - Brendan Rodgers criticises him for swapping shirts with Pepe at half time, saying "It's something that doesn't happen here and shouldn't happen here”

2014 - One match suspension and £25,000 fine for posting anti-Semitic and racist references on social media

2015 – Scores winner vs Besiktas from the spot, following altercation with captain over who was to it.

Career Stats:-

Club…………………………National

170…………Played…………33

67…………..Scored…………13

51……….Yellow Cards…….5

4…………..Red Cards……….1

So here’s the question:-

Is he worth the hassle?

Not very good stuff in his short career is it?

Some of those things you would laugh at,but is he a pro? I don't think he is worth the hassle for ANY club.

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

100% spot on Ed

All of these people are dealing in Hypotheticals what if henderson missed how about what if he scored???

People are saying it's ok because he scored' date=' but that is not the point and the fact so few people seem to actually see the bigger point is disturbing

What is the point of having a heirachy, what is the point of having a manager, what is the point of having a Captain if some players believe they are above taking there place in the Heirachy.

It is the managers call that is what he is payed for to take decisions[/quote']

Exactly,its not even an argument.

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

Hendo was named spot kick taker prior to KO and Mario being on the pitch. If BR really wanted Hendo to take that pen he would of it's as simple as that. The fact that BR let Mario take it tells me he had no problem with it and probably preferred it. It was a big pen so your best spot kick taker has to take it. Amount of fuss been made over it is embarrassing.

^

Like what others have said too, if Henderson was really bothered about Balo taking the penalty, then Balo wouldn't have taken it, simple as that.

We have set FK and corner takers too, because other players take the free kick/corner off them then why aren't you all moaning about that? From what I understand, certain people are saying it's not the penalty, it's the fact that he took it off our 'set taker'.. So when someone else other than Gerrard/Coutinho takes a corner/quick corner, I expect you to be upset about it from here on out, because they aren't our set takers. :)

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

Hendo was named spot kick taker prior to KO and Mario being on the pitch. If BR really wanted Hendo to take that pen he would of it's as simple as that. The fact that BR let Mario take it tells me he had no problem with it and probably preferred it. It was a big pen so your best spot kick taker has to take it. Amount of fuss been made over it is embarrassing.

Positive that Rodgers and Gerrard did an interview early saying Balo would take penalties in Gerrards absence.

After watching it again I feel as if Hendo was designated the penalties unless Balo was on the pitch, hence why Rodgers didn't look disappointed and why Hendo did, I'm guessing Rodgers explained that to him after the game and that's why he seemed ok with it in the interview.

Truth is we don't know what the plans were or even if Hendo was designated the penalties, we're basically taking sides, let us be honest we don't know anything about the plans Balo could easily have been told he takes them when Gerrards not on the pitch and that Hendo takes them in Gerrards absence. We won everyone seems fine it's alright.

I'm just really disappointed in Gerrard to make public comments it's caused unnecessary pressure on a player who has been improving immensely recently, we are on great form and the squad looks happy, just absolutely no need to say anything and as captain he should know so much better and I'm so surprised he's avoiding criticism on here and by pundits. Look at how Everton did it Naismith and Baines coming out and diffusing the situation and denied problems and I'm guessing Martinez dealt with it in training.

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

In a club and team environment' date=' individual decisions like this should not be justified by the outcome. The club live and die by the managers instructions being executed on the pitch. What next? Balotelli decides he doesn't like being on the bench so doesn't turn up? He doesn't want to train in the afternoon because he feels he's better refreshed the next day? Maybe Rodgers asks him to play wide left but Balotelli decides he's better down the middle?

[/quote']

This is stupid. Like LL and others said, if Rodgers didn't want Balotelli on the penalty, he wouldn't have taken it. If Henderson wanted to take the penalty, he would have taken it. I just can't even put into words how OTT the above is actually. :o

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

Missing the point again...

No, i'm not missing the point. The point is that there was a penalty, the best penalty scorer in the pitch took it and nailed it.

Oh yeah, Hierarchy's and complete lack of respect and rules, oh rules.

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

^

Like what others have said too' date=' if Henderson was really bothered about Balo taking the penalty, then Balo wouldn't have taken it, simple as that.

We have set FK and corner takers too, because other players take the free kick/corner off them then why aren't you all moaning about that? From what I understand, certain people are saying it's not the penalty, it's the fact that he took it off our 'set taker'.. So when someone else other than Gerrard/Coutinho takes a corner/quick corner, I expect you to be upset about it from here on out, because they aren't our set takers. :)[/quote']

What? This doesn't even make sense! Your another that's missing the point! This has nothing to do with who takes what, it has everything to do with hierarchy, roles and responsibilities.

"if Hendo was really bothered?" He cant control Balo, that's the point - it appears that no one can. Hendo should have been more forthright immediately to stop the situation escalating but once it had what was he supposed to do? The line had been crossed. This isn't about how everyone needs to manage Balo its about Balo working for the team and accepting the tactics given to him. he should not be putting Hendo in that position.

When was the last time you saw Gerrard have the ball taken off him for a free kick? When was the last time you saw Countinho have the ball taken from him for a corner? Both players may allow other to take their kicks for them - in game management takes place all the time and depends on what is happening in game but there will most definitely have been discussion post, pre or during a game. Have you never played football or any team sport?

This was a single player taking it upon himself to very publicly take the ball from the captain in clear violation of the tactics afforded to that team.

But forget the inane ramblings of supporters and forget anyones opinion on here - including my own - and focus on this:-

Gerrard, Rodgers, Hendo and Sturridge (at least) were unhappy with the situation. That tells you that it was unacceptable to the team and the way it is set up. Therefore Mario was wrong to do what he did.

Because of that anyone defending what Mario did really is making themselves look foolish and I simply do not understand such stated foolishness.

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

No' date=' i'm not missing the point. [b']The point is that there was a penalty, the best penalty scorer in the pitch took it and nailed it.[/b]

Oh yeah, Hierarchy's and complete lack of respect and rules, oh rules.

So its that you actually understand the point but are basically ignoring it cos the ball crossed the line.

Oh and this is the fact - not the point.

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Re: Official Liverpool Thread

Those believing that Balotelli wouldn't take the ball off whoever had it to take a penalty is as deluded as those that think it was fine for him to overall team orders, this is exactly the kind of thing he just does - Rodgers & Liverpool knew what they were taking on when signing him & at the end of the day he won you the game with his 93% penalty success ratio.

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