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I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...


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Well, during my roughly 2 years here, I've been very active at some occasions on this forum and during some occasions, I haven't stayed active. However, one thing that will never really change, is the individuals who are looking down at forumers/persons who are supporting a team from (far) away - the so called ''Glory Hunters''. To be honest, I have a problem with these individuals who are calling out certain forumers and give them nicknames (Arm Chair fan, Glory Hunters and etc...). Do you have problems with these kind of supporters?

For all you chelsea glory hunters who didnt turn up today and stayed at home with the heating on watching sky sports news HAVE THAT !
I'm done with you and you're excuses. Arm Chair fan

^^I've seen various quoted such as these around at some threads^^

Although they weren't directed at me, I still take a hit from these kinds of posts (and I'm sure other distance-fans does). Why are people getting called out just beacuse they support Liverpool or Real Madrid? Do you have to live in Liverpool/Everton or alteast come from the same nation to support these clubs? It isn't a rule and it isn't an un-written rule aswell, so-to-say. I feel very privileged to support an older team (Milan), who haven't been winning trophy for some season, I feel very privileged to support a flat broke team (Schalke), who haven't won a title for years and I feel very privileged to support another flat broke (and poor) team in Lens. The only reason I can't follow them that closely (going to the stadium and such) as certain individuals are able to do, is beacuse of A: My age. B: I don't speak neither French, German nor Italian, so I'd be finding it hard to go there. I follow these team as much as much as possible. For instance, when my city-team (Gif Sundsvall) played a knock-out game with Gefle inorder to crown the third promoted team in Allsvenskan (as in Gif's case) or as the third relegated team (as in Gefle's case), I decided to not follow my mates to the stadium and cheer for Gif, as I wanted to stay home and see Milan play the same evening in Serie A, does it make me a glory hunter then?

I don't indend to point out certain individuals, but I am getting really frustrated when I see these kinds of posts. Do you really have to be from this country or come from this city to support that team or this team? For all of those who don't agree with what I am saying, explain why you disagree, beacuse I'd really want to see what kind of pathetic excuses you've got. It's not like you have the experience of living outside the country your beloved team comes from...

Btw, this site is a Swedish sport site. It covers bascially any major sport from every corner of the world. The best of all? A certain teams news-flash, is only represented from the supporters to that team.

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

Personally Pazz i would say its unimportant who you follow and where they come from ....if you accept that's its all about Definition ....

Supporter = Someone who regularly attends games

Fan = Someone who doesn't

Therefore it follows someone who lives in Hull ( who never attends games ) can claim to be a Real Madrid Fan but not a supporter, that title is reserved for people who bother to attend the games, get me ? :)

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

Pazz, I'm with you 100%, but you won't get far with some people. There's some sort of elitist mentality from people who own season tickets to see their local club each week. How that makes you better than someone who doesn't get the opportunity to watch their favourite side is beyond me.

Also, I disagree with an element of your counter-point Dave. If a Man Utd fan (or whoever) buys a shirt each season and subscribes to Sky/ESPN television (or whatever it may be in other country's), are they not supporting their club? After all, they are funding the income of the club, so surely that's a method of supporting the club?

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

Personally Pazz i would say its unimportant who you follow and where they come from ....if you accept that's its all about Definition ....

Supporter = Someone who regularly attends games

Fan = Someone who doesn't

Therefore it follows someone who lives in Hull ( who never attends games ) can claim to be a Real Madrid Fan but not a supporter' date=' that title is reserved for people who bother to attend the games, get me ? :)[/color']

I completely agree with this. I don't think it should matter were you come from. As I see plenty of people from outside Liverpool when I go the match one man by me travels up to Goodison for every game from Plymouth and if he is willing to show that much dedication to get the match surely should be able to call themselves a supporter.

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

I think a lot of the 'glory hunting' arguing comes down to one simple fact, and that is that a lot of the fans of the big teams that live a distance away seem to have no actual reason to support them. I've said it before, my first choice team will ALWAYS be Coventry City, my home team that have been my team from the moment i liked football, but i also support 2 other sides. They are Chelsea and Rushden & Diamonds. I, unlike some Chelsea fans i know from Coventry, have a reason why i support them.

Now, let me explain where the arguing comes from. I, a Chelsea fan, have supported them for a good few years now, long before Mourinho and Drogba and the Premier League titles. I supported them from the days of Viali, Poyet, Wise, Zola, Hasselbaink. Why? Well, it's because of a couple of reasons. One, the game where they played Coventry and had to wear our away kit because their kit man forgot we both wore blue! Two, another game vs Coventry, a 2-2 draw i attended where Coventry twice took the lead just for Mr.Zola to equalise exactly 2 minutes later each time. I grew fond of them because i saw them first hand and they grew on me in terms of how they played their football. Now, compare that to some of the other Chelsea fans i know from Coventry, who support them because, and i quote "they won the title" or "Drogba's wicked" or even, and this one made me angry "their kit looks nice!"

If you have true, proper reasons to support those clubs, then by all means go ahead, but if it's because they win games or wear a nice striped kit, then i'm sorry, but you are insulting a lot of true fans who go the extra mile to support the team they love.

I've travelled to about 10 Chelsea games over the years that were not against Coventry in Coventry, i've seen them at Stamford Bridge, soaked up the atmosphere, and let me tell you this, travelling to London from Coventry aged 15 wearing a Chelsea shirt is a scary experience. It was worth it though.

The armchair fans just sit and opinionate themselves, acting like fans who spend hundreds and hundreds of pounds going to the games and putting up with the highs and lows that come with it, and that's what annoys some, including might i add some of the real diehard fans of that club itself.

As for your comment of not travelling to your local sides game to watch Milan on TV, i have to just comment on the fact that as a result of you doing that, your team will have lost out on a ticket sale. True, that may only be about £10, but imagine if 1,000 more people did the exact same thing? That's suddenly £10,000 lost. I see it at the Ricoh Arena every single season, Coventry will have 18,000 fans there one week, then suddenly 12,000 when Chelsea vs Man.U is on Sky Sports. Why can't you record the match? Get the in-game commentry on Sky News or ESPN maybe? If more and more people begin to the make the decision of staying in for a televised game rather than going to cheer on a side in the stadium, then we'll slowly see more and more clubs die and cease to exist. In my eyes, NOTHING beats being at the game, the travelling, the banter in the stands. Wearing your 6 different layers in winter and still shivering away. The announcer giving the other scores and 15,000 people cheering when your local rival is 3-0 down!

It just seems a little easy to sit at home with the heating on watching a game on TV with all the action replays spoiling if it was a handball or a penalty. Armchair fans know if the ball crossed the line, they know if he was really offside, the fans in the stadium have to speculate and banter away about the referee being wrong again.

As i've said before, i have NO issues with fans supporting teams that arn't local IF they have valid reasons. If however they just say it's because they win or any rubbish like that, and never go to the games, and never show their face when the teams on a bad run, and just sit there slating some people for supporting the likes of little ol' Coventry City, then they fully deserve to be branded as glory hunters etc etc, as they clearly have no intentions of being there for the side when they struggle.

You say you support Lens/Shalke etc who i admit have not lit up the footballing world in recent years, but what are your true reasons? If you have good ones, i don't mind that at all, and good luck to your teams in the future. :)

My final final thing to say in this post, if Chelsea are playing in the champions league on a tuesday night, and Coventry are playing at the Ricoh, guess where i'll be.....that lovely chilly stadium under floodlights watching my beloved Sky Blues. The Chelsea game? That's covered, the commentary's on the phone and Sky Sports is being recorded at the same time. My home team still see me, my money and my support, and i still know how my other team is doing :)

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

Well' date=' during my roughly 2 years here, I've been very active at some occasions on this forum and during some occasions, I haven't stayed active. However, one thing that will never really change, is the individuals who are looking down at forumers/persons who are supporting a team from (far) away - the so called ''Glory Hunters''. To be honest, I have a problem with these individuals who are calling out certain forumers and give them nicknames (Arm Chair fan, Glory Hunters and etc...). Do you have problems with these kind of supporters?

^^I've seen various quoted such as these around at some threads^^

Although they weren't directed at me, I still take a hit from these kinds of posts (and I'm sure other distance-fans does). Why are people getting called out just beacuse they support Liverpool or Real Madrid? Do you [b']have[/b] to live in Liverpool/Everton or alteast come from the same nation to support these clubs? It isn't a rule and it isn't an un-written rule aswell, so-to-say. I feel very privileged to support an older team (Milan), who haven't been winning trophy for some season, I feel very privileged to support a flat broke team (Schalke), who haven't won a title for years and I feel very privileged to support another flat broke (and poor) team in Lens. The only reason I can't follow them that closely (going to the stadium and such) as certain individuals are able to do, is beacuse of A: My age. B: I don't speak neither French, German nor Italian, so I'd be finding it hard to go there. I follow these team as much as much as possible. For instance, when my city-team (Gif Sundsvall) played a knock-out game with Gefle inorder to crown the third promoted team in Allsvenskan (as in Gif's case) or as the third relegated team (as in Gefle's case), I decided to not follow my mates to the stadium and cheer for Gif, as I wanted to stay home and see Milan play the same evening in Serie A, does it make me a glory hunter then?

I don't indend certain individuals, but I am getting really frustrated when I see these kinds of posts. Do you really have to be from this country or come from this city to support that team or this team? For all of those who don't agree with what I am saying, explain why you disagree, beacuse I'd really want to see what kind of pathetic excuses you've got. It's not like you have the experience of living outside the country your beloved team comes from...

Btw, this site is a Swedish sport site. It covers bascially any major sport from every corner of the world. The best of all? A certain teams news-flash, is only represented from the supporters to that team.

I agree mate alot of people just say it and annoy you but i feel it doesnt matter were your from as long as ur loyle to the team then it doesnt matter, theres alot of people who are like this dont wanna mention names but lets be fair as long as ur not init for the glory then ur a fan.

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

Pazz' date=' I'm with you 100%, but you won't get far with some people. There's some sort of elitist mentality from people who own season tickets to see their local club each week. How that makes you better than someone who doesn't get the opportunity to watch their favourite side is beyond me.

Also, I disagree with an element of your counter-point Dave. If a Man Utd fan (or whoever) buys a shirt each season and subscribes to Sky/ESPN television (or whatever it may be in other country's), are they not supporting their club? After all, they are funding the income of the club, so surely that's a method of supporting the club?[/quote']

It’s a wavy line alright Andy and fraught with contradictions, nevertheless to successfully answer the point it’s a line that must be applied. You can’t really compare some bod in Hastings walking around in a Man Utd shirt to a guy (wherever he comes from) that gives up hours of his free time going to the games can you?…Maybe the argument should be about whether someone can call themselves a fan or a supporter ?.

Of course it used to be a lot easier a few years back, I spent years going all over the place with the Lions and always considered myself a Millwall supporter, since I stopped going I wouldn’t dream of calling myself anything else than someone who has a passing interest in what’s going on down there and how they are doing. It’s a bit like saying that someone who buys every Tom Jones CD is as committed to the great man as someone who goes to his concerts and throws their underwear at his godlike image, like ( despite being arrested twice) I have done on many occasions :o;)

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

Personally Pazz i would say its unimportant who you follow and where they come from ....if you accept that's its all about Definition ....

Supporter = Someone who regularly attends games

Fan = Someone who doesn't

Therefore it follows someone who lives in Hull ( who never attends games ) can claim to be a Real Madrid Fan but not a supporter' date=' that title is reserved for people who bother to attend the games, get me ? :)[/color']

Surely, by definition, a supporter is someone who supports a club. So if they hand over money to buy club merchandise, subscribe to team TV channels, etc. then why shouldn't they, by definition, be seen as a supporter, just as those who hand over money to attend games also be seen as supporters?

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

Surely' date=' by definition, a supporter is someone who supports a club. So if they hand over money to buy club merchandise, subscribe to team TV channels, etc. then why shouldn't they, by definition, be seen as a supporter, just as those who hand over money to attend games also be seen as supporters?[/quote']

Logically you are correct Jooles, but are you not forgetting that there is more to supporting a club than buying a few trinkets?

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

Surely' date=' by definition, a supporter is someone who supports a club. So if they hand over money to buy club merchandise, subscribe to team TV channels, etc. then why shouldn't they, by definition, be seen as a supporter, just as those who hand over money to attend games also be seen as supporters?[/quote']

Was just about to post a similar post. A club can be supported from all over the world. Where the word "fan" meaning "fanatic" is a much stronger word imo. Someone who is a fanatic has an "excessive enthusiasm and intense devotion". So personally I'd say it's hard to be a fan without going to at least some games, whereas being a supporter is totally different.

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

Was just about to post a similar post. A club can be supported from all over the world. Where the word "fan" meaning "fanatic" is a much stronger word imo. Someone who is a fanatic has an "excessive enthusiasm and intense devotion". So personally I'd say it's hard to be a fan without going to at least some games' date=' whereas being a supporter is totally different.[/quote']

Perfectly reasonable in my opinion Ben and by switching the two perhaps makes the point a lot clearer. In my day it was the other way around but that was a long time ago before the global expansion of the game ( I am very old). :(

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

Logically you are correct Jooles' date=' but are you not forgetting that there is more to supporting a club than buying a few trinkets? [/color']

Of course, but then we enter a definitional morass. Does someone who attends games have to be vocal? Is the armchair 'fan' who dedicates his whole day preparing for the game, spending the entire 90 minutes shouting and encouraging his team less of a supporter than someone who buys a ticket, turns up a little after kick-off, heads down before half-time for a pint or two, leaves before the end to avoid the rush, and sits passively in their seat chatting to their mate more about the totty they pulled last night than the game itself? Unfortunately these things don't fit into nice tight little definitions, life would be so much easier if they did.

(Actually I nearly got divorced by the missus over an argument about how to define being human. There was little me thinking it was just an interesting intellectual exercise whereas she got all hot-headed and saw it as a reason to deny me those little marital necessities. Some people! :rolleyes:)

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

Of course' date=' but then we enter a definitional morass. Does someone who attends games have to be vocal? Is the armchair 'fan' who dedicates his whole day preparing for the game, spending the entire 90 minutes shouting and encouraging his team less of a supporter than someone who buys a ticket, turns up a little after kick-off, heads down before half-time for a pint or two, leaves before the end to avoid the rush, and sits passively in their seat chatting to their mate more about the totty they pulled last night than the game itself? Unfortunately these things don't fit into nice tight little definitions, life would be so much easier if they did. [/quote']

Stop being so woolly about the whole subject Jooles, of course there is a difference, I am not knocking anyone but there always has been and always will be. :)

(Actually I nearly got divorced by the missus over an argument about how to define being human. There was little me thinking it was just an interesting intellectual exercise whereas she got all hot-headed and saw it as a reason to deny me those little marital necessities. Some people! :rolleyes:)

Women, but tell me did you manage to convince her that you are? B)

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

Pazz' date=' I'm with you 100%, but you won't get far with some people. There's some sort of elitist mentality from people who own season tickets to see their local club each week. How that makes you better than someone who doesn't get the opportunity to watch their favourite side is beyond me.

Also, I disagree with an element of your counter-point Dave. If a Man Utd fan (or whoever) buys a shirt each season and subscribes to Sky/ESPN television (or whatever it may be in other country's), are they not supporting their club? After all, they are funding the income of the club, so surely that's a method of supporting the club?[/quote']

Completely agree!

Too many times this 'talking down' to other fans because they can't or don't go to games. Its shocking.

Great thread. Its an absolute hate of mine.. I doubt it will change the mind-set of the silly ones that think that way though.

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I just don't understand why it's an issue really. It seems to be used as a get out clause by some, as if typing out that sentence leads to some sort of divine intervention whereby they win the argument.

If somebody is talking nonsense then call them on it, irrespective of whether they go or not. If on the other hand a person makes interesting and insightful points about football then I couldn't give a monkeys if they have never stepped inside a football ground in their lives.

You undoubtedly miss out on certain aspects of being a 'fan' (I'm not going to get into the semantics argument because it's genuinely one of the most soul destroyingly boring thing I've ever encountered) by not going to games, but why it becomes an issue when deciding who's opinion is more valid I just don't know. Baffling.

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

Ok so here it is. I'm one of the silly ones who will happily call Man Utd fans, living in Croydon who have never been to a game, glory supporters.

One question to you lot who are 'real supporters' of a club 300 miles away...

It's England (or where-ever you are from) vs Brazil in the WC semi finals.

Who do you support?

Brazil because they're better to watch, you like their players, and because you like dancing the samba?

Or England, because that is where you're from?

Exactly, support your home/family team, you glory supporters. You're not a proper fan of the club, you're a fan of the football.

Nothing is more frustrating than some scum fan who has been to one pre-season friendly in his life, taking the mick out of me after arriving home from a 800 mile round trip to Norwich where we lost 3-0.

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

Exactly' date=' support your home/family team, you glory supporters. You're not a proper fan of the club, you're a fan of the football.

[/quote']

What if you live in Greenland? seriously, what if you live somewhere where there is no decent football. lichtenstien. malta. guatemala. nepal. liverpool. china. the list goes on.

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

Decent football being the key word.

well, thats what i mean. theres 0 chance of nepal making it to the world cup within the next 30 years. if someone from nepal follows belgian football, the local league, the smaller divisions, the national team, everything... does that make him a glory hunter?

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

I just don't understand why it's an issue really. It seems to be used as a get out clause by some' date=' as if typing out that sentence leads to some sort of divine intervention whereby they win the argument.

If somebody is talking nonsense then call them on it, irrespective of whether they go or not. If on the other hand a person makes interesting and insightful points about football then I couldn't give a monkeys if they have never stepped inside a football ground in their lives.

You undoubtedly miss out on certain aspects of being a 'fan' (I'm not going to get into the semantics argument because it's genuinely one of the most soul destroyingly boring thing I've ever encountered) by not going to games, but why it becomes an issue when deciding who's opinion is more valid I just don't know. Baffling.[/quote']

Dull maybe, but whilst i am pretty indifferent nowadays i can certainly understand a supporters ( my term) side of the argument, certainly in my day ( yes the game was different) but i always considered a fan as someone who sees a club as a hobby or casual entertainment. Whereas supporters take it an awful lot more seriously. No matter where or when the club plays, or how important the match is, the supporter is there. A lot of times this means sacrificing other aspects of his life, work, family, friends etc. A Supporter will defend the club's name, loyalty and honor, if necessary often getting into trouble. Simply shouting in front of the telly is not enough, nor is wearing a replica shirt or subscribing to 4-4-2. If you accept that mindset exists then you can clearly see why a supporter will always question a fans opinion and commitment.

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

Dull maybe' date=' but whilst i am pretty indifferent nowadays i can certainly understand a supporters ( my term) side of the argument, certainly in my day ( yes the game was different) but i always considered a fan as someone who sees a club as a hobby or casual entertainment. Whereas supporters take it an awful lot more seriously. No matter where or when the club plays, or how important the match is, the supporter is there. A lot of times this means sacrificing other aspects of his life, work, family, friends etc. A Supporter will defend the club's name, loyalty and honor, if necessary often getting into trouble. Simply shouting in front of the telly is not enough, nor is wearing a replica shirt or subscribing to 4-4-2. If you accept that mindset exists then you can clearly see why a supporter will always question a fans opinion and commitment.

[/color']

in that case, the entire world, all clubs combined, contains about 21 people who can be considered as supporters.

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Re: I need a rant - If you are passionate, have a look...

Ill give me thoughts on a topic , iv recently submitted a piece of work on.

For me, i think it is important for any fans to have a connection with a club, be it geographically, or you had family there / descend from there, for them to be considered highly identified fan.

I guess thats down to individual interpretation, i dont think iv had such a problem with it if people who chose teams who they had no connection to that werent topping the league and in the champions league. Why doesnt Ipswich have loads of random fans ? Answer... because they havent won as much as Liverpool / Chelsea / United, and so people dont decide to support them.

These kind of fans are motivated by the aesthetic experience of supporting that club ( as stated, usually good teams, and so, the style and quality of football is greater than most, making it appealing ) in comparison to people who support local teams as they feel it is obligatory, as if they have a relationship with the club and it represents the community they are from. These later fans, attend more games than most as they are highly identified with the club, its part of their life ( generally speaking ).

There are several reasons to why people watch football, for anyone that is interested in fandom and fanship, i suggest you read work by Wann.

Speaking of whom, he designed a Sport Fan Motivation Scale (1995), that suggests reasons to why people watch sport.

Group Affiliation

Aesthetic experience

Eustress

Entertainment

Escape

Economic

Family

and Self Esteem.

I would presume that people who support "random" teams are motivated by Aesthetic experience, Entertainment and Self esteem

- Aesthetic experience , as mentioned they tend to chose good footballing sides, so they can appreciate the technical element of the game

- Entertainment, winning titles.

- Self Esteem, if you support a succesful team, and are a highly identified fan, you often find fans refer to the club / team as "we" and "us". When the team wins, they win, and so self esteem is boosted.

Im not saying its a good or bad thing, just suggesting a few reasons to perhaps why people, support teams they have no connection with.

My opinion though, as a fan, is that you should really have a connection with a club to support them. Obviously im not going to knock a bloke from essex who supports Plymouth, what grinds my gears is the people under the umbrella of "glory hunters".... i just dont see the enjoyment in picking the best team in the world and following them for no reason.

:)

Daves definition of a fan and supporter is'nt to far off !

Taken out of my assignment :D:P

A Sports fan is simply defined by Wann et al (2001) as an individual with an enduring interest in sport. Porat (2010) offers a specific definition and describes a football fan as one whose devotion to a particular club dominates his entire way of life. It is important to understand the differences between a fan and a spectator. A spectator may well be interested in the same team as a fan, and will follow them, and may sometimes watch live events but their attachment to the club is not valued importantly by themselves (Wann et al, 2001).

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