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Englands wonderkid - Jack Jebb

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Re: Englands wonderkid

i think wenger deliberately chooses players from the continent instead of british players. It's not anything to do with technical ability or skill, it's because of the life-style they lead. 9 time out of 10 whenever you hear of a player involved in a punch up at some night-club wrecked out there face they're british.

a professional athlete should never drink, and i think that's the main reason that our national teams are so **** because after a game on a saturday the players go out and get wrecked, wenger recognises this and avoids british players because of this. you can't really blame him for the players not fulfilling there potential if they're out on the drink every weekend.

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Re: Englands wonderkid

wow at last a sensible answer! Its because he can go to africa and pick up the same quality player for nxt to nothing! We under perform because too much preasure is heaped on the england national team! Plus English players have a technical deficency,where by they cant keep and pass the ball. Bad grass roots training where 7 year old kids play on near full size pitches and get taught to "Give it a boot" to the big cf up front!

This video shows why we have the problem of not being able to do the basics well...

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Re: Englands wonderkid

Theo Wallcott has not developed into the talent we all thought he would be.

Jermaine Pennant wasnt developed correctly' date='Matthew Upson was supposed to be as good as terry but under wenger dissapeared into the wilderness.

David Bentley has only come into his own since he moved to spurs.

Richard Wright never reached his potential. James Harper yes whos that ur thinkin....It was Englands wonderkid under wenger,but now at the dizzy heights of Hull city.

Jay Bothroyd he dismissed as a schoolboy and plays for cardiiff....compare that to fergies record of developin english players?

Tell me one English superstar Wenger has fully developed?[/quote']

ashley cole?

if he was not fully developed

chelsea would not have bought him

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Guest Villa888

Re: Englands wonderkid

Thought he would be an Arsenal player..

Just curious' date=' who did Wenger "mess up"?[/quote']

Pretty much every young player to come through the academy that wasn't bought other then Wilshere.

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Re: Englands wonderkid

Pretty much every young player to come through the academy that wasn't bought other then Wilshere.

Arsenal have one of the best academys in the world and produce top players year after year....I'm not 100% sure but did guys like Fabregas, Vela, Gibbs, Traore, Song, Szeceny(spelling) diaby not all start in the academy.

and you've got Frimpong, Sunu and the young spanish defender Miguel all coming through.

an Arsenal supporter could probably name 20 more

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Re: Englands wonderkid

Saw this mad crazy footballer called Jack Jebb (Arsenals youth side) at home park against Plymouth youth team. Absolute quality...lets hope wenger doesnt mess up with another English talent

walcott is only 21 and still has time to prove himself.

this is my future england team:

hart

richards cahill smalling gibbs

walcott rodwell wilshere jarvis

welbeck carrolll

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Re: Englands wonderkid

walcott is only 21 and still has time to prove himself.

this is my future england team:

hart

richards cahill smalling gibbs

walcott rodwell wilshere jarvis

welbeck carrolll

Remove Richards and replace with Nathaniel CLyne, for me. Richards can't defend

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Re: Englands wonderkid

Arsenal are famous now for being 'the academy' of English football, but that's more like a marketing ploy/excuse for not winning/dream.

Reality is Arsenal and Arsene Wenger have produced very few talents themselves who have actually achieved anything in the game beyond the occasional good performance in the League Cup. Its not like they go on to win it.

They don't even win their reserve or youth leagues/cups, nevermind dominate them like the best young teams do.

Like a lot of top clubs right now, a lot of Arsenal's youth is brought in at a later stage, it still takes some skill to get them into the first team set up mind you so I'm not saying their youth strategy is bad, just that it's evolved into some false myth where Arsenal provide the best football education in the land.

How many of the current first team squad actually came through the arsenal academy vs Utd, Chelsea, Spurs etc? Lets post players and age when joined shall we? I will ignore anyone who joined when he was older than 21.

Arsenal

Diaby - 19

Fabregas - 16

Nasri - 21

Van Persie - 21

Vela - signed at 16 but didnt join until 18

Walcott - 17

Denilson - 18

Song - 18/19

Wilshere - 9

Djourou - 16

Clichy - 18

Gibbs - 15

Bendtner - 16

Szczęsny - 16

Man Utd

Gary Neville - 15/16

Wes Brown - 15

Anderson - 19

Rooney - 19

Giggs - 14

Smalling - 21

Nani - 21

Fabio and Rafael - signed at 16/17, joined at 18

O'Shea - 17

Evans - Utd trainee at 9

Fletcher - 16

Obertan - 21

Macheda - 16

Gibson - 17

Bebe - 20

Amos - 11

Morrison - 16

Then you have guys like Cleverley, Welbeck, Diouf doing well on loan and ex players like Ronaldo, Rossi, Pique lighting up the spanish league and Ebanks Blake, Richardson, Eagles, Shawcross, Bardsley, Simpson, and others doing well on these shores.

It really is an absolute myth that Arsenal are the best youth academy in England. Compare the ages and is debateable if their kids are better than our kids, then compare the medals and its not even a contest.

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Re: Englands wonderkid

Arsenal are famous now for being 'the academy' of English football' date=' but that's more like a marketing ploy/excuse for not winning/dream.

Reality is Arsenal and Arsene Wenger have produced very few talents themselves who have actually achieved anything in the game beyond the occasional good performance in the League Cup. Its not like they go on to win it.

They don't even win their reserve or youth leagues/cups, nevermind dominate them like the best young teams do.

Like a lot of top clubs right now, a lot of Arsenal's youth is brought in at a later stage, it still takes some skill to get them into the first team set up mind you so I'm not saying their youth strategy is bad, just that it's evolved into some false myth where Arsenal provide the best football education in the land.

How many of the current first team squad actually came through the arsenal academy vs Utd, Chelsea, Spurs etc? Lets post players and age when joined shall we? I will ignore anyone who joined when he was older than 21.

[b']Arsenal[/b]

Diaby - 19

Fabregas - 16

Nasri - 21

Van Persie - 21

Vela - signed at 16 but didnt join until 18

Walcott - 17

Denilson - 18

Song - 18/19

Wilshere - 9

Djourou - 16

Clichy - 18

Gibbs - 15

Bendtner - 16

Szczęsny - 16

Man Utd

Gary Neville - 15/16

Wes Brown - 15

Anderson - 19

Rooney - 19

Giggs - 14

Smalling - 21

Nani - 21

Fabio and Rafael - signed at 16/17, joined at 18

O'Shea - 17

Evans - Utd trainee at 9

Fletcher - 16

Obertan - 21

Macheda - 16

Gibson - 17

Bebe - 20

Amos - 11

Morrison - 16

Then you have guys like Cleverley, Welbeck, Diouf doing well on loan and ex players like Ronaldo, Rossi, Pique lighting up the spanish league and Ebanks Blake, Richardson, Eagles, Shawcross, Bardsley, Simpson, and others doing well on these shores.

It really is an absolute myth that Arsenal are the best youth academy in England. Compare the ages and is debateable if their kids are better than our kids, then compare the medals and its not even a contest.

The only problem, my dear friend, is that the Arsenal players you listed are better than the Man Utd players :rolleyes:

Can you provide a better example please?

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Re: Englands wonderkid

Arsenal are famous now for being 'the academy' of English football' date=' but that's more like a marketing ploy/excuse for not winning/dream.

Reality is Arsenal and Arsene Wenger have produced very few talents themselves who have actually achieved anything in the game beyond the occasional good performance in the League Cup. Its not like they go on to win it.

They don't even win their reserve or youth leagues/cups, nevermind dominate them like the best young teams do.

Like a lot of top clubs right now, a lot of Arsenal's youth is brought in at a later stage, it still takes some skill to get them into the first team set up mind you so I'm not saying their youth strategy is bad, just that it's evolved into some false myth where Arsenal provide the best football education in the land.

How many of the current first team squad actually came through the arsenal academy vs Utd, Chelsea, Spurs etc? Lets post players and age when joined shall we? I will ignore anyone who joined when he was older than 21.

[b']Arsenal[/b]

Diaby - 19

Fabregas - 16

Nasri - 21

Van Persie - 21

Vela - signed at 16 but didnt join until 18

Walcott - 17

Denilson - 18

Song - 18/19

Wilshere - 9

Djourou - 16

Clichy - 18

Gibbs - 15

Bendtner - 16

Szczęsny - 16

Man Utd

Gary Neville - 15/16

Wes Brown - 15

Anderson - 19

Rooney - 19

Giggs - 14

Smalling - 21

Nani - 21

Fabio and Rafael - signed at 16/17, joined at 18

O'Shea - 17

Evans - Utd trainee at 9

Fletcher - 16

Obertan - 21

Macheda - 16

Gibson - 17

Bebe - 20

Amos - 11

Morrison - 16

Then you have guys like Cleverley, Welbeck, Diouf doing well on loan and ex players like Ronaldo, Rossi, Pique lighting up the spanish league and Ebanks Blake, Richardson, Eagles, Shawcross, Bardsley, Simpson, and others doing well on these shores.

It really is an absolute myth that Arsenal are the best youth academy in England. Compare the ages and is debateable if their kids are better than our kids, then compare the medals and its not even a contest.

I would also like to point out how much money Man United spent on the players you listed. Rough estimate well over 60 mill compared to the Arsenal players probably not even half that. Spending 30 mill on the likes on roonery, 20 mill on Nani, 22 mill on Anderson and so on. It doesnt seem fair to say Man United trained them up as they were already special when Ferguson brought them.

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Re: Englands wonderkid

Well' date=' I have one question to ask you.

Did Wenger say they were were gonna be legends?

OR was it people like you who kept overrating them and put pressure on them to become WC under which they buckled and you know blame Wenger.

Please, Bentley is a joke.

Compare Fergie's record to Arsene's record of making kids from ABSOLUTELY ANY NATIONALITY world class?!

[b']Cardiff.. is nothing, I could play for em.[/b]You last question shows how much you know about football. lol.

There are Cardiff fans on this forum you know! We may not be in the Premiership, but we're not that bad... and we're not nothing! :mad::(:P

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Re: Englands wonderkid

There are Cardiff fans on this forum you know! We may not be in the Premiership' date=' but we're not that bad... and we're not nothing! :mad::(:P[/quote']

What I meant was, I'm so awesome that I can actually get into their team :D

And sorry to any Cardiff fans whose feelings were hurt, didn't mean it that way :o

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Re: Englands wonderkid

What I meant was' date=' I'm so awesome that I can actually get into their team :D

And sorry to any Cardiff fans whose feelings were hurt, didn't mean it that way :o[/quote']

Don't worry I took it as a joke and I'm sure any Cardiff fans who read your post probably did. ;)

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Re: Englands wonderkid

I would also like to point out how much money Man United spent on the players you listed. Rough estimate well over 60 mill compared to the Arsenal players probably not even half that. Spending 30 mill on the likes on roonery' date=' 20 mill on Nani, 22 mill on Anderson and so on. It doesnt seem fair to say Man United trained them up as they were already special when Ferguson brought them.[/quote']

what currency are you using? Nani and Anderson were cheaper than Walcott (£17m). Ronaldo was £12m.

But like I said, these players were bought in and for arsenal to include them as products of their wonderful academy is silly. Players who can qualify for that (I will even give you Walcott):

Arsenal

Fabregas - 16

Vela - signed at 16 but didnt join until 18

Walcott - 17

Wilshere - 9

Djourou - 16

Gibbs - 15

Bendtner - 16

Szczęsny - 16

Man Utd

Gary Neville - 15/16

Wes Brown - 15

Giggs - 14

Fabio and Rafael - signed at 16/17, joined at 18

O'Shea - 17

Evans - Utd trainee at 9

Fletcher - 16

Macheda - 16

Gibson - 17

Amos - 11

Morrison - 16

All of which cost much less than Walcott alone. and would still be cheaper if I decided to include Cleverly, Welbeck, Ronaldo, Pique, Rossi on that list.

Arsenals fabled youth academy produces some nice football now and then, but in terms of players who have actually gone on and done anything with their careers, there is almost no one.

and their current crop isnt even that young anymore! there were periods where Utd were fielding younger teams and doing just as well recently. I bet I could field a squad with a lower age average and it would seem as strong as anything Arsenal could field with more genuinely home grown players to boot.

Arsenal's youth academy is as much a myth as Rafa's amazing managerial skills.

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Re: Englands wonderkid

what currency are you using? Nani and Anderson were cheaper than Walcott (£17m). Ronaldo was £12m.

But like I said' date=' these players were bought in and for arsenal to include them as products of their wonderful academy is silly. Players who can qualify for that (I will even give you Walcott):

Arsenal

Fabregas - 16

Vela - signed at 16 but didnt join until 18

Walcott - 17

Wilshere - 9

Djourou - 16

Gibbs - 15

Bendtner - 16

Szczęsny - 16

Man Utd

Gary Neville - 15/16

Wes Brown - 15

Giggs - 14

Fabio and Rafael - signed at 16/17, joined at 18

O'Shea - 17

Evans - Utd trainee at 9

Fletcher - 16

Macheda - 16

Gibson - 17

Amos - 11

Morrison - 16

All of which cost much less than Walcott alone. and would still be cheaper if I decided to include Cleverly, Welbeck, Ronaldo, Pique, Rossi on that list.

Arsenals fabled youth academy produces some nice football now and then, but in terms of players who have actually gone on and done anything with their careers, there is almost no one.

and their current crop isnt even that young anymore! there were periods where Utd were fielding younger teams and doing just as well recently. I bet I could field a squad with a lower age average and it would seem as strong as anything Arsenal could field with more genuinely home grown players to boot.

Arsenal's youth academy is as much a myth as Rafa's amazing managerial skills.[/quote']

Im using wikipedia for how much players cost. It says walcott was only £9.1 while Anderson was €30 million and Nani was €25.5. My point is if you look at how much money Man Utd spent its way more then Arsenals. To say they are trained by United is a bit of a joke. Ronaldo was born special all they had to do was play him.:) Arsenal has the better academy.

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Re: Englands wonderkid

what currency are you using? Nani and Anderson were cheaper than Walcott (£17m). Ronaldo was £12m.

But like I said' date=' these players were bought in and for arsenal to include them as products of their wonderful academy is silly. Players who can qualify for that (I will even give you Walcott):

Arsenal

Fabregas - 16

Vela - signed at 16 but didnt join until 18

Walcott - 17

Wilshere - 9

Djourou - 16

Gibbs - 15

Bendtner - 16

Szczęsny - 16

Man Utd

Gary Neville - 15/16

Wes Brown - 15

Giggs - 14

Fabio and Rafael - signed at 16/17, joined at 18

O'Shea - 17

Evans - Utd trainee at 9

Fletcher - 16

Macheda - 16

Gibson - 17

Amos - 11

Morrison - 16

All of which cost much less than Walcott alone. and would still be cheaper if I decided to include Cleverly, Welbeck, Ronaldo, Pique, Rossi on that list.

Arsenals fabled youth academy produces some nice football now and then, but in terms of players who have actually gone on and done anything with their careers, there is almost no one.

and their current crop isnt even that young anymore! there were periods where Utd were fielding younger teams and doing just as well recently. I bet I could field a squad with a lower age average and it would seem as strong as anything Arsenal could field with more genuinely home grown players to boot.

Arsenal's youth academy is as much a myth as Rafa's amazing managerial skills.[/quote']

Have you also noticed how the players you have mentioned for Man Utd are from mostly around Britain while those for Arsenal are from all over the world?

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Re: Englands wonderkid

Im using wikipedia for how much players cost. It says walcott was only £9.1 while Anderson was €30 million and Nani was €25.5. My point is if you look at how much money Man Utd spent its way more then Arsenals. To say they are trained by United is a bit of a joke. Ronaldo was born special all they had to do was play him.:) Arsenal has the better academy.

I guess it's a bit of a joke to say Fabregas was trained by Arsenal' date=' after all clearly he was born special, all you had to do was play him.

Maybe you should read this article below about 'Which club's academy produces the most players that are good enough to become senior players at any Premier League club'. Pretty straight forward evidence as to which club has the best academy.

http://articles.squarefootball.net/squarefootball/2010/09/manchester-uniteds-youth-system-is-the-best-in-the-premier-league.html

And @ Nikidinho - "The only problem, my dear friend, is that the Arsenal players you listed are better than the Man Utd players". Don't embarrass yourself.

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